Money Laundering regulations - The Book-keepers Forum (UK)

pmcclure · Veteran Member

Money Laundering regulations

Shamus · Forum Moderator & Expert

Hi Peter,

sure that the message is well intentioned but I feel that you need to put such into context as many of the people on here are completely new to the world of bookkeeping and accounts and are at times not completely sure that they have jumped through all of the right hoops to be where they are.

Please allow me to expand for you.

One of the primary reasons for joining a supervisory body such as the ICB, IAB, AAT etc. is that you are covered for MLR under the unbrella of your supervisory body without registering with HMRC directly.

It would be a very foolish individual who offered services directly without being either a suitably qualified member of a supervisory body or having registered directly.

With all of the regular advice on this site I don't think that you will find many if any members of the bookeepers forum who need to be covered for MLR who are not.

If your a newbie reading this don't worry. When you gain your practicing certificate you will be covered for MLR without having to register anywhere else.

Hope that clears up any misunderstandings.

kind regards,

Shaun.

BackOfficeGroup · Guru

Thats a very pointed question and I doubt anyone would actually admit to not being registered for MLR if they are providing services for bookkeeping in their own name.

I had to transfer my previous business to an accountant to get the cover for MLR as I did not want to register directly with HMRC for various reasons and am currently working on getting my practice licence from ICB to cover me for a new business venture in this arena.

I think waiting for HMRC to catch up with you is the wrong attitude to take and believe me, you don't want the wrath of HMRC on your back! It will end your career. These days its not if but when.

My thoughts...

P

stephen72 · Senior Member

I agree ,The penalties are harsh for those found to be practicing and not carring out the correct procedures.I may be wrong but i am sure that i have read somewhere that if you are a member of the icb and you have not followed the correct procedures you will be expelled from them.
stephen

maxmillion · Member

I have recently (January/February 2010) obtained my Level 2 Manual and Computerised bookkeeping certificates after completing a course at a local college.
One is OCR, the other from City & Guilds.

But neither course tutors advised us about this registration requirement, and I have already effectively started my business with a website, 2 clients, and more on the way.

Only my enquiries with ICB today, have suggested that I am breaking the law.
Anyone know what the penalties are, and when I need to register by? I will of course register, but it was just an unexpected bomshell, along with the info that my qualifications weren't good enough for the ICB.

-M

Wella · Expert

Hi M

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news and it's not a good position to be in.

HMRC can impose a civil penalty, what ever they deem fit

Failing to register can also carry a criminal conviction of up to 2 years in prison and/ or unlimited fine.

If you can't get into an institute that exempts you from registering, you can register directly with HMRC

A couple of links you might find useful

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/mlr/mlr8.pdf

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/mlr/getstarted/register/who.htm#6

This one is the HMRC wesite page that is concerned with registering

Bill

chellawson · Senior Member

I too only found out about the money laundering via this website, my college never mentioned it either and when I raised the question at college they said that they run their course for people who are intending to work for an employer and not be self employed. I studied OCR last year and this year im doing AAT still no meation of it though.

I am going to register direct with HMRC in the next couple of months.

Michelle

semsley · Guru

Maxmillion

If you are not registered for Money Laundering Regulations then you are not allowed to offer your services as a bookkeeper. To do so contravenes the Money Laundering Regulations (2007), Terrorism Act(2000) and Proceeds of Crime Act (2002).

To offer your services without MLR carries the risk of heavy fines and/or imprisonment.

You can register direct with HMRC cost £120 for premises and £50 for person.

Or, try the IAB rather than ICB I think you will find they will recognise your level 2 manual whether it is from OCR or C & G, if so you will become covered by them in your membership fee which, is cheaper.

chellawson · Senior Member

Hi Semsley,

Im a little confused, I have the forms but there are no fees mention. I was under the impress it was £120.

Im intending on working on my own a couple or hours a week to start. So would I only need to pay £50 then.

Michelle

Shamus · Forum Moderator & Expert

Hi Michelle,

Yes.

Its £120 per property £50 per person.

Hi Sheila,

Just passing through to check on what's occurring (yes, I have got Welsh roots!).

Looks as though you've been taking notes when I've got my legal hat on... On that note, there's alsothe Criminal Justice Act (1993) sorry, forgot about that one in all the excitement first time around.

Hi Bill,

The maximum prison term is also 14 years rather than 2 but you have to be particularly naughty to be hit with that one.

Right, back to trying to install this software for teaching myself advanced Taxation. BPP are being really helpful but they've basically sold me a disc with packaging with someone elses security key so the security codes aren't matching up. Just waiting for the latest email to see if we can get this any further...

Talk in a bit,

Shaun.

Wella · Expert

Welcome back Shaun, hope you got an absense note.

I restricted my answer to the failing to comply with MLR reg 45. I think you are refering to penalties that could be imposed under PoCA?

I've had two sealed products from Sage that had the same thing (They seem to have a universal key that unlocks everything)

Bill

chellawson · Senior Member

Hi,

Just spoken to HMRC regarding MLR fees, the very nice lady has said that it is £120 I assume that is because I would be working alone and that if you had other people working then the £50 per person applies.

She also said it can take upto 48days but normally its not as long as that.

Michelle

Shamus · Forum Moderator & Expert

Hi Bill,

I'm now in the software! Jeez, wished I wasn't. It's orrible.

Anyway, been trying to install it since the postman brought it at 10:30 this morning.

The softwares brand new for exams in June and December this year. Suspect that I'm actually one of the guinea pigs on this.

The guys at BPP were really helpful and bent over backwards to try and help which is quite nice compared to some help desks that I've dealt with in the past.

The impression that I got was that the securities been upgraded but someone omitted to tell the front desk about it.

Ended up with tech support getting involved and having worked in that world I'll have money on it that they've had to change their security programs on the fly to recognise the format of the new codes.

The amount of things that go wrong for me if I didn't know better I would swear that I was actually life's control experiment!

It's taken so long to get this working that I really don't want to play with it anymore today. What a waste of a day and good online chatting time that was then.

Off to put tea on, back in a bit.

Shaun.

Wella · Expert

Shamus wrote:

The amount of things that go wrong for me if I didn't know better I would swear that I was actually life's control experiment!

Now who's being paranoid?

Glad you finally sorted your software

My turn to go and sort tea out - hope you enjoyed yours

Bill

Oops just burnt me sausages writing this

-- Edited by Wella on Wednesday 24th of February 2010 06:24:43 PM

chellawson · Senior Member

Wish sage were as helpful, Ive still got a training disk I cant use, hmmmm

steve12 · Veteran Member

Hi Maxmillon, Your OCR and City and Guilds bookkeeping qualifications are some of the best qualifications you could have, certainly they are very widely recognised and better than the ICB qualification. You should register direct with HMRC , and they have a very good website. Alternatively, as has been already mentioned, the IAB (International Association of Bookkeepers) are the most professional bookkeeping organisation in the UK with vast experience of the bookkeeping profession and they will accept your qualifications towards membership.

Steve.

lor · Guru

Shamus wrote:

Hi Michelle,

Yes.

Its £120 per property £50 per person.

Hi Sheila,

Just passing through to check on what's occurring (yes, I have got Welsh roots!).

Looks as though you've been taking notes when I've got my legal hat on... On that note, there's alsothe Criminal Justice Act (1993) sorry, forgot about that one in all the excitement first time around.

Hi Bill,

The maximum prison term is also 14 years rather than 2 but you have to be particularly naughty to be hit with that one.

Right, back to trying to install this software for teaching myself advanced Taxation. BPP are being really helpful but they've basically sold me a disc with packaging with someone elses security key so the security codes aren't matching up. Just waiting for the latest email to see if we can get this any further...

Talk in a bit,

Shaun.

Shamus, I am a 1/4 welsh!

lor · Guru

the rest is english! lol!

I am also covered by MLR through AAT.

-- Edited by lor on Wednesday 24th of February 2010 09:41:13 PM

kjmcculloch · Guru

It appears to me to be yet another stealth tax. I'm not quite sure what I've actually received for my money. Neither am I sure how paying all this money helps us to comply with the EU directives?

Perhaps someone wiser can explain it if I'm way wrong.

Kris

-- Edited by kjmcculloch on Wednesday 24th of February 2010 10:40:34 PM

semsley · Guru

Kim

You are 100% correct.

maxmillion · Member

steve12 wrote:

Your OCR and City and Guilds bookkeeping qualifications are some of the best qualifications you could have, certainly they are very widely recognised and better than the ICB qualification.

Thanks Steve. Very reassuring.

And thanks to all for your helpful advice and comments