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Wella


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Just thought I get the opinion of others regarding subsistence meals and it's treatment as an expense.

I have thumbed my way through just about everything on the HMRC site and from what I can ascertain, subsistence can only be claimed if it involves an overnight stay.

Then I read that lorry drivers can claim a subsistence allowance for meals during the day (something like £2/ day).

Does anyone know the ruling for it being a legitimate deductible expense, from my experience of HMRC, they don't like giving too much away and I would have thought that eating a meal is a natural requirement and not a business requirement and most people would eat anyway.

Bill

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stephen72


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Hi Bill.
I always post receipts for subsistence as drawings unless as you say it is a stay over at a hotel etc
stephen

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Islandgirl


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What about the VAT on these expenses?

I'm talking about someone who travels quite a lot and submits his meal receipts to be treat as a business expense.  These are typically meals eaten 'away from home' on overnight/extended business trips, so from your comments above I'm assuming these are OK and that where VAT receipts are provided this can be reclaimed?

Thanks



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Rhianrach


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Someone I know who goes on business trips to conventions etc put all their hotel and meal expenses through, they were told to by the vat man.

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Steve
Shamus


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Hi Bill,

I'm with you on the fact that the expense would have been incurred anyway so why would it be allowable. However, there does seem to be an allowable allowance for meals in certain circumstances.

I think that as a general rule subsistence would not be allowable but in certain circumstances where a journey is being made for genuine business purposes (such as long distance lorry drivers).

Expenses can include :

* public transport fares
* hotel accommodation
* meals
* tolls
* congestion charges
* parking fees
* business phone calls, fax or photocopying costs

I thought that the maximum for a meal was £5 but you're probably right at £2.

Details of how to get the various reliefs can be found here :

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/incometax/how-to-get.htm

Also take a look at this page which is where I got the above list from :

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/incometax/relief-travel.htm#1

I won't bother going into Luncheon vouchers as the 25p per day tax free is hardly worth mentioning!

Hope that the above links help.

Kind regards,

Shaun.


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Shaun

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Rhianrach


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How did the job interview go Shaun, have you heard anything yet?

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Steve
Shamus


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Hi Steve,

they had two more last minute interviews on Friday and the person who is supposed to make the decision was off yesterday.

If I don't hear anything today I will just assume that the position went to someone more local and I'll start looking around again.

When we were chatting with the person in Pakistan last week I don't think that they really had any idea how tough and competitive the job market is in this country at the moment.

Hows life with you matey?




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Shaun

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Wella


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As usual, thanks for all you input guys.

Shaun don't you become Super Guru or something in 12 more posts?

Hope you are all having a sunny day

Bill

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Shamus


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Ooh, I'd forgotten that.

I think that I become Mutley or something as doesn't the little red star change to a medal?... Actually, being provisional wing conservative a little red star was never really me anyway!

I'm sure that if Manjinder asks any more questions related to shortcuts to becoming an accountant today then I'll probably sail through the 1500 post mark.

Did you notice that Rob was on for a while yesterday.

He was off again by the time that I realised that he had been here so didn't get chance to say hi.

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Shaun

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Wella


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Mutley? Hmm are there enough characters in Whackey Races for everyone?

Oh no, red stars! I thought they were sheriffs badges (well at least deputy sheriff) better crack on and post another 848 replies to earn my medal too.

I suspect Rob is really, really busy wink.gif

Bill



-- Edited by Wella on Tuesday 22nd of June 2010 11:59:36 AM

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RobH


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Hi guys...been very busy and had lots of staffing issues! So just popping in and out!

Regarding subsistence Bill, I always allow a reasonable amount of subsistence if the client is working away from home even if they do not have a night over.

Shaun I think the £5 you remember is the 'PIE' allowance (personal incidental expenditure). I think this is employee expenses when staying overnight, enough for a burger and a beer! It doubles to a tenner if staying abroad I believe. These figures have been the same for about 20 years!

Rob

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Shamus


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Hi Rob,

you've been missed matey... Was beginning to think that Bill and Myself might have to start answering some of the more difficult questions ourselves!

Cheers for the info on subsistence.

Are your staffing issues now resolved?

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Shaun

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Rhianrach


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Shamus wrote:

Hi Steve,

they had two more last minute interviews on Friday and the person who is supposed to make the decision was off yesterday.

If I don't hear anything today I will just assume that the position went to someone more local and I'll start looking around again.

When we were chatting with the person in Pakistan last week I don't think that they really had any idea how tough and competitive the job market is in this country at the moment.

Hows life with you matey?


Lifes Ok just looking forward to giving up my job of drinking beer and looking after my daughter for a job that pays wages, not overly sure I've made the right choice wink

 



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Steve
RobH


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Hi Shaun,

no staffing problems still continuing but I am hoping it will be resolved shortly. A while ago I took on a 61 year old lady but on her first day she called in to say that she had forgotten that she plays tennis on mondays, tuesdays, wednesdays, thursdays and of course Fridays! She clearly thought better of coming back to work.

I then took on a self employed bookkeeper who was a disaster in both knowledge and actually getting any work done.

Then went for a youngster who wanted to be trained up, she was really good but had too many child care issues.

Still upwards and onwards!

You, Bill, Shiela et al cope very well without my input!

Rob

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ProBowlUK


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RobH wrote:
Regarding subsistence Bill, I always allow a reasonable amount of subsistence if the client is working away from home even if they do not have a night over.


Dunno about the £5 PIE (no chips ?),  but when I was a subcon brickie I always put down about £20 per week subsistence for meals and travelling.  It was never questioned.

That was around 30 years ago.    wink

 

 

 

 

 



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Bob Sharp
RobH


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Some industries/ trade associations have an agreed amount with hmrc where receipts aren't needed. I think the Road Haulage Association has an amount for over nighters, and of course a lot of lorry drivers will sleep in the cab and still claim for a nights b&b!

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semsley


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The theatre company I work for has a dispensation from HMRC at £12.50 per day for subsistence (without receipts).

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Jane


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Hi Bill

I recently went on a 'becoming self employed' course with HMRC and subsistance was discussed.  In general you can't claim for lunch if you are away for just the day as it is assumed that you could have made your lunch before leaving and if you bought it than you would have anyway so it is not an out of pocket expense.  If however you are staying overnight that is different and you can then claim.  Don't know what the levels are. 

J

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Shamus


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Hi Bill, Steve, Rob, Attila,

Just as I get a site promotion to expert it's off back to the life of a banker for me.

Just got an answer from sunny Scotland and they've confirmed that I've got the job so it's back to doing the M6 every Sunday and Friday for at least the next six months!

The hotel that I normally use has got Wifi access so fingers crossed I'll still be able to keep abreast of things on here.

Only downside is that I won't have access to my library whilst I'm away so not sure how useful my replies will be.

Right, bank contract sorted. Now where did I put that Porsche brochure (joke!!!!... I'm actually looking for the Koenigsegg brochure).



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Shaun

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Rhianrach


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Shamus wrote:

Hi Bill, Steve, Rob, Attila,

Just as I get a site promotion to expert it's off back to the life of a banker for me.

Just got an answer from sunny Scotland and they've confirmed that I've got the job so it's back to doing the M6 every Sunday and Friday for at least the next six months!

The hotel that I normally use has got Wifi access so fingers crossed I'll still be able to keep abreast of things on here.

Only downside is that I won't have access to my library whilst I'm away so not sure how useful my replies will be.

Right, bank contract sorted. Now where did I put that Porsche brochure (joke!!!!... I'm actually looking for the Koenigsegg brochure).


Awesome congratulations Shaun oh and i'd go for the koenigsegg just for the wow factor.

 



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Steve
semsley


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Well done Shaun six months worth of guaranteed income is not to be sneezed at

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attilabenko


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Hi Shaun,

Congratulations for your new job and your expert title!

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Attila
RobH


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Well done Shaun...we'll have a whole host of 'banker' jokes ready for you! I'm sure we can find a few 'expert' ones too!

All the best...enjoy the commute!

Rob

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Shamus


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Cheers Rob, Atilla, Sheila, Steve,

actually I quite enjoy the commute bit, it's when you get there that the problems start!

At least living out of a suitcase I should get the opportunity to do some serious studying in the evenings.

I missed paper P2 this June as it was on the same day as the interview in Scotland. As it was I still found myself lacking knowledge in certain areas (group cashflow statements... Still!) which is no way to go into an exam and if you pass knowing that it's just the luck of the questions that's no way to have any pride in your achievement.

Oops, getting off piste. Got loads to sort out before Sunday so catch you all in a bit and thanks again for your messages of support.


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Shaun

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Amanda


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Well done Shaun,

I expect you will miss your boy.

Bet it nice to know you will have a regular income for 6 months.

regards
Amanda

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Amanda
Shamus


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Cheers Amanda,

it's a killer being away from him so long. he was heart broken yesterday when I got the "good" news so we spent the latter part of the afternoon with little fishing nets catching stickle backs which cheered him up no end.

We've now got a little fish tank with five stickle backs in it.

I enjoy bookkeeping but without the occasional banking contract we wouldn't be able to afford to live.

Its the only being permitted to offer services up to trial balance that the real killer for me.

Fingers crossed once I've finally got those ACCA letter after my name I might be able to make better money from this side of the fence and not have to spend months stockpiling money in order to support working from home.

Hope that your having a good day today,

talk in a bit,

Shaun.

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Shaun

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Wella


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Shaun

Sorry I've been a bit busy and have just got round to reading this.

Well done on getting your job and for achieving Expert status. Personaly I rank the Expert status as the greater of the two achievements but it doesn't put a crust on the table (if only it did - sigh)

Again, Well Done      handshake.gif    clap.gif  w00t.gif   worship.gif

Bill

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Shamus


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Cheers Bill,

Good to hear that your busy matey.

On the expert status thing though it did occur to me that one could achieve such by asking 1500 questions and never actually giving an answer!






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Shaun

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semsley


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Exactly.  One liner attempting to achieve guru biggrin


-- Edited by semsley on Thursday 24th of June 2010 04:10:54 PM

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BackOfficeGroup


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Good news Shaun, best fo luck!!

I know how you will feel, as I have just finished my 12week stint (which turned out to be 6 months!) in sunny B'ham, but now am back at my desk....

in regard to the question, if you have dispensation from HMRC, you can claim expenses on subsistence etc for whatever amount (within reason) and you can claim the VAT if registered.

thats for Ltd co's, for sole traders, I'd stick to the £5 for lunch £10 evening meals but only when working away from home.

P

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