I am looking to set up a book-keeping business in South Wales and want some advice on what people think are sensible charges. I'm ACCA qualified, but haven't yet got my practicing certificate - hence the book-keeping!
I'm wanting to ideally do a set fee arrangement for bookkeeping packages depending on how much or how little the client wants to hand over.
Ask around at competitors in the area would be the first step. Generally I would say a good bookkeeper is around £15 to £25 per hour depending on what you do.
Be wary about ACCA and bookkeeping - you are really restricted with what you can do. Is there a reason you haven't got the PC yet?
__________________
Phil Hendy, The Accountancy Mentor
Are you thinking of setting up your own practice or have you set up and need some help?
If so a mentor may be the way forward - feel free to get in touch and see how I can assist you.
I haven't got the PC as I haven't been working in practice, rather for small businesses instead.
I have already been consulting the ACCA handbook with regards to what I can and cannot do as I don't want to fall foul of anything, although I am also going to try to get a friendly accountant to help me with the stuff I can't do/mentor me in the process.
Welcome to the forum. Nice to have more of the Welsh contingent on here.
As for rates it's one of those things where everything depends on what the local market can bear.
You're going to be hit with the same problems that I suffered in that clients expect bookkeepers to just be cheaper accountants offering the same services. However, as you say you are going to be restricted to bookkeeping to trial balance, VAT and Payroll.
That is of course unless you can find a qualified accountant to work under the supervision of and even then without the practice certificate you're not going to be able to mention you're ACCA status anywhere in you're advertising.
(Are you getting the feeling yet that you're dealing with a fellow sufferer of the ACCA rules!).
Personally I've found that I couldn't make a living out of the restricted services alone which means that I offer the bookkeeping pretty much as an add on to other services such as Excel development and project management.
I advertise bookkeeping at £20 per hour (VAT inclusive) and other services at £35 per hour (VAT inclusive) but if I was trying to win bookkeeping clients then I would struggle even to get the £20 rate for the restricted services that I can actually perform for clients.
Before the relaunch of the business, first time around at one point my rates actually sank below £10 per hour but that was only short term in order to gain some quite specific experience.
As it is I am able to offer more than basic services as I work closely with a local qualified practicing accountant but first time around I didn't have that luxury which ended up with me going back to banking for six months whilst I rethought the business plan.
So, having experienced your dilema myself my advice would be to try and get a local accountant to supervise your work in order to offer a wider range of services so that you are able to compete against local bookkeepers who will be offering final accounts and tax related services.
Don't even try to win clients on a lowest price strategy as there is always someone out there who will undercut you (a fair few not having insurance or even MLR cover!).
I think that £15 per hour is an often quoted average but again, that can vary greatly.
good luck with the new venture and don't forget to keep us all informed as to how your business progresses.
kindest regards,
Shaun.
P.S. I've either got the start writing faster or writing less! Hi Phil. Now why didn't I just write everything out in two paragraphs as I think we ended up saying pretty similar things!
-- Edited by Shamus on Monday 19th of September 2011 04:59:34 PM
__________________
Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
Hi Seamus, Yes, I find it deeply frustrating, especially considering that Joe Bloggs with no qualis at all can advertise as an accountant (grumble)!
It's come about through starting work at a company that wanted an accountant and then went "aha! we can have another string to our bow by offering these services" - so I have now been given the job of getting it all up and running. That being said, if they decide against it in the long term, I may well carry on with it myself, as I will have everything in place I am definitely going to try to partner with an accountant to solve a number of the problems.
I must admit though, the fact I can't even use my letters after my name is really cheesing me off!
And also as far as ACCA rules go there is no difference between someone who has just signed up for paper F1 and someone who has suffered the whole qualification!
I'm having real jip getting past P2 but then I'll be in the same position as yourself. However, as things stand as far as setting up as bookkeepers go there is no difference between us even though you've already nailed it.
The whole thing is just wrong isn't it.
Also, if you want to get really annoyed try joining the ICB as they don't recognise the ACCA qualification unless you've passed F3 within the past two years!
Conversely, the IAB do recognise the ACCA qualification for full exemption is you wanted to go that way for your MLR.
Personally I've now gone with HMRC directly.
Also of course, you could now get full exemption from AAT so go straight to MAAT MIP but then your services are still restricted to the maximum that you can offer under the more Draconian ACCA rules so you would end up as an MAAT MIP only able to offer bookkeeping to trial balance, VAT and payroll.
As you say, if we had no qualifications at all then we could just set up as accountants but because we do things properly we spend thousands on study in order to be able to do less than if we hadn't spent anything at all.
It can get really frustrating and to be honest, last year it got to the stage where I was just about ready to jack the qualification (but I'm just too pig headed to ever admit defeat).
__________________
Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
I've just realised you say you have gone to HMRC directly for your MLR. I think you may have problem with this later. I was told at the beginning of this year that HMRC admit that anyone who is a member of any of the MLR approved professional bodies must register with one of the bodies and not the HMRC. Unfortunetely the HMRC will take you money and its only if they do a monitoring visit, do they then disclose this. (Refunds are not given!).
This is why the IAB now insist that Associate members apply to them as previously they said they had to apply directly to HMRC. Previously only IAB Member & Fellows used to be able to apply.
-- Edited by YLB-HO on Monday 19th of September 2011 06:04:21 PM
I stood down from the ICB due to the issues of what I wasn't allowed to do because of my ACCA student membership and I'm not yet a member of the ACCA (just a student still until I get that darn P2 under my belt) so MLR cover is not available from them.
I can see what you mean though when I get membership but am not yet permitted to have practicing certificate due to lack of two years post qualification experience under a suitably qualified accountant then HMRC will regard me as a member of the ACCA but the ACCA won't cover me for MLR.
When it gets to that stage (fingers crossed after the next sitting) I think that I'll be knocking on your door asking about IFA membership.
kindest regards,
Shaun.
__________________
Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
I am definitely going to try to partner with an accountant to solve a number of the problems.
