I don't want to generalise but I probably will - they cause so much damage to people's confidence and drive to achieve their ambitions.
I'm constantly picking up the pieces. This week I've had a potential customer who was advised that qualfications count for nothing, it's experience they need. And, a student who was told don't even bother looking for jobs until you're qualified.
I constantly hear this feedback from students - my advice is by all means listen to them but NEVER depend on their advice, in fact go and PROVE THEM WRONG.
A qualification is an end result of training and usually you learn because you need to develop yourself. Many of my students say the biggest thing they've got from studying is confidence and a great sense of achievement and self belief - it's not just about the word `qualification`.
Life is like a bag of licorice allsorts I suppose (sorry can't spell that).
But you have to appreciate that in many instances agents work like gate keepers with the jobs all on the other side of the gate.
It's a common misconception that they represent the job seeker. They don't they represent the person who is paying them, not the commodity that they are selling.
If you can't get past them then those jobs stay just out of reach.
The issue I believe is that they have too many CVs hitting their desks so they can provide better than required for less than requested.
Agents want to put forwards candidates who will put them in good stead with their clients and the best combination for that is experience backed by the qualifications that employers are looking for.
Don't get me wrong. I think that they are wrong and that they miss some real gems whose CVs never even see the employers desks. But, in a market with so many applicants for every job they don't need to be flexible or try to spot the hidden gems.
I have to disagree with the line that qualification is an end result as personally I would regard it as the first step.
As for agents giving advice... Well, they seem to make up their own rules without actually going through any of the study or anguish of a qualification themself yet still they somehow seem to feel themselves above those that they (supposed) to represent.
kind regards,
Shaun.
__________________
Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
but you've had interviews meaning that your CV is at least getting to the desks that matter which is half the battle... Of course the other half is the other applicants for the job.
Don't assume that experience is everything. When you get to interview the biggest question in the interviewers mind is whether this person will fit in the organisation... And more to the point whether they could sit opposite the person for at least the next six months of their life!
When you get to interview do not let the number of other people there phase you. It's your job and they are just there to make up the numbers. If there are two people at interview it is the wrong mindset to think that the other person must have got the position.
Confidence (but not cockiness) goes a long way at interview.
Right, time for a story.
Most lucrative (overall) position that I ever won was on a seven year project working with KPMG. There were a couple of dozen people to be interviewed and only one job. Half way through the interview I had the impression that the interviewers were tuning out (probably from interview fatigue as I was not the first and there were plenty more after me).
The interviewer asked me the next question on his list which was "What do you feel that you can bring to this role?" to which my response was "Awful ties and alcohol abuse". In any other scenario that would have been completely the wrong answer but in this instance it made them sit up and take notice throughout the rest of the interview.
The key is that you need to read your audience in a not dissimilar way to playing poker (I personally would never gamble but I understand the principle).
Of course, the other key to interviews is going in with the attitude of wanting the job but not needing it (similar to the scenario with trying to take out a bank loan).
Unfortunately getting into that latter mindset when you need the job is near impossible.
Oh, and the time to get up and walk out of an interview is when you get a couple of Muppets on the other side of the desk asking you "if you were a fish, what sort of fish would you be?"... That was only the second interview that I had ever walked out of. The first one was where I told the two interviewers that they did not know enough to be on that side of the desk. lol.
right, what other posts are there this morning,
all the best matey,
Shaun./
__________________
Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
"Oh, and the time to get up and walk out of an interview is when you get a couple of Muppets on the other side of the desk asking you "if you were a fish, what sort of fish would you be?"... That was only the second interview that I had ever walked out of."
I hope that before you walked out you answered the question with "The one that got away." - That's what I would have done.
__________________
Vince M Hudd - Soft Rock Software
(I only came here looking for fellow apiarists...)
Did anyone hear about that guy who offered his services in a real billboard and the other one who morphed his CV into an Amazon page with a review or something that read ' ONLY ONE LEFT - PLACE YOUR ORDER NOW '
"Oh, and the time to get up and walk out of an interview is when you get a couple of Muppets on the other side of the desk asking you "if you were a fish, what sort of fish would you be?"... That was only the second interview that I had ever walked out of."
I hope that before you walked out you answered the question with "The one that got away." - That's what I would have done.
lol Vince,
no, mine was a far more conservative "I really think that we're wasting each others time here".... Darn it, wish that I had thought of your retort.
It definitely seems a common misconception amongst interviewers that the interview is only one way. i.e. do they want to offer you the job. They miss completely that following a poor showing at interview by the firm the candidate may not feel that it is in the best intertest of their career (or sanity) to work with them!
And that brings up another issue with agents.
In a scenario where a firm has been misrepresented to the candidate. For example you go for one position but find that the position on offer is something completely diferent. If you refuse the position that is offered then the agent is unlikely to contact you again, or at least not contact you as a first resort even though it was their fault for misrepresenting the position on offer.
Worst that I've had was turning up for an interview for what I had been told was a senior business analyst position and finding that the job was for a COBOL programmer! Ironically, I got the job that I went for (on a different project) even though it wasn't the one that was being interviewed for... And then the scumball agents try to scupper the deal by trying to charge some huge fee for finding me for a role that they had not even put me forwards for.
And on that note, another scenario with an agent was being approached directly by a previous client who was not allowed to take me on directly but I had to go through an agent. I contacted the preferred agency about the psoition and then nothing... wait, wait, wait... Call the agents to be told that the position had actually now been filled internally.
Went out for a few beers with the guys at the site only to be met with a shame that I couldn't take the role as the guy that the agency had put in was crap!
Long and the short was that the agency was getting x amount for placing someone and I would have taken considerably more of that amount than the person that they put forwards.
Nice end to that story is that I started at the site the following Monday through the new preferred supplier.
If only all these things ended fairly!
__________________
Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
