Pricing for new client - The Book-keepers Forum (UK)

Nikole · Senior Member

Pricing for new client

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

Hi Nicola
Three choice to my mind:-

1) They are happy with bookkeeper apart from her pricing and just looking for the cheapest option - decline.

2) You have quoted your price. Tell them the same price.

3) Them waving a pile of papers at you does not help with pricing and nor does giving you a list of what cheques were issued, but what else is on those bank statements, how many items of 'petty cash' or cash dealings are there, credit cards used etc - so tell them that the other option is to have a good look at the paperwork supplied which will give you more on an idea what to quote (assuming you are now going for a fixed rate or at least to provide an indication of hours). Whatever you do - set your boundaries, eg if there is an increase in 'x' then your price goes up 'y'. (Plus with any luck you will see what the other bookkeeper is charging!)

Dont forget its not just about the pieces of the puzzle that they think they know about but journalling for accruals, prepayments, payroll etc. It might not be much but price it all in. Dont under-sell yourself.

One other thing I found interesting though is that you didnt meet with the decision maker in the first place - something I would never do, but wondering how that one came about.

Nikole · Senior Member

Hi Joanne

Thank you for the response.

Originally i took my car in for a repair and thought id leave some of my business cards there as you never know. Anyway the owners son who is taking more control of the business contacted me and asked me to go in for a chat. He explained that there expenses are increasing too much and he is wanting to cut back. I think the bookkeepers fees have been steadily increasing too.

Ideally i am hoping to have a good look through the paperwork tomorrow and hopefully get them to show me a bank statement for the month so at least i know what i am up against. I didnt want to give a set price because it's all good them saying that they provide the perfect shoe box of paperwork but that rarely happens. (Not to me anyway)

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

They don't do any car sales do they?

Even without the above, there is usually quite a lot of paperwork with garages, even if they use one main supplier for most of their parts. There will be quite a few sales invoices and possibly a fair amount of cash payments. Also worth checking if they update the sales invoices with how they are paid, keep good track of their visa debit etc little slips-if they are organised then it could be smooth running, but if disorganised then it will be a complete mess. Don't forget to build in time to reconcile their statements from whoever their card machine provider is, plus there is usually a fair bit of petty cash tallying to do. Reckon the son might not have a clue (second generation in business often don't!!) and be trying to pull the wool, so tread carefully.

Ask them if they have any plans to change their business model any time soon, ie take on something else given that generally speaking the independent garage (which I'm assuming they are) is a bit of a dying breed.

Also check out their staff turn, as that can create work on the payroll front, plus of course if they are weekly paid that all adds to the bill.

Nikole · Senior Member

It is an MOT repair garage. There are 5 employees to process the payroll for and they are thinking of lengthening the payroll to monthly to reduce costs. They didnt mention any changes to me. You have definately helped me out with what i need to investigate whilst there (Thank you)

Amanda · Expert

I used to do a garage a few years ago, it was far bigger than I had anticipated and loads of paperwork. Also on their invoice, that's hoping they have a separate system for invoicing, if they have servicing and MOT on the same invoice let's hope they haven't put VAT on the invoice for the MOT as that part is exempt (well it was when I was doing it, I am assuming it hasn't changed since).

There are a lot of overheads with garages, as they have to have licenses for MOT's, and often equipment is lease hire or some sort of HP loan as its very expensive. (I'm talking ramps etc).

Having learnt my lesson rather quickly, and after a couple of years parting company I wouldn't be keen to take on another one. It's a very cut throat trade, so I expect he is counting the pennies. Also like Joanne said if he is only getting rid of her due to pricing, then don't bother as you will end up working for very little and it just isn't worth it!

HTH

Nikole · Senior Member

Gosh - I think i need to be asking quite a few questions tomorrow. I am now beginning to wonder if the bookkeepers invoices are higher because they have become unorganised. Thank you for your feedback Amanda.

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

Hi
Just to clarify (not sure if its changed but) MOTS are not exempt but outside the scope. So at least you havent got all that partial exemption issue.

Unless of course they dont do their MOTs in house and buy in the service from another garage, although from what Nicola says thats also not an issue.

But Amanda is spot on that they need to have a separate line on their invoicing and ensure that the dont get that element wrong.

Just another thing I thought of just now - what software do they use for their bookkeeping? Also then what software do they use for invoicing? Often they have specific vehicle management software, although if the bookkeeping software is sage (proper sage) then most of them feed in so thats less of an issue, but worth having on your radar.

First question should be the usual - tell me about your business (which of course you know, but you can expand on that easily), then ask what it is that they want doing differently by you rather than the existing bookkeeper as that will give you a flavour of what is going on.

Other thing to add on to what Amanda says about you working for next to nothing goes back to my very first point (1) above. At some point they might consider you too expensive if all they are bothered about is keeping costs low, rather than getting a proper job done. So if you do take it on - dont go down to their level, but do watch your back and make sure they pay their bills promptly!

Nikole · Senior Member

Hi Joanne

They dont have any invoicing software. All invoices are handwritten carbon copies. I am not sure what software the currect Bookkeeper uses. When you say feed in do you mean a feed from the vehicle management doftware to Sage? Proper Sage as in which package.

They did point out that there vat bill had increased alot and they didnt know why. Makes me wonder if vat is being added to the customer invoices for MOT and supply and fit.

I definately wont be selling myself cheap. I did that with my very first client who after 3 years i still havent put their rate up.

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

Hi Nicola
Sory yes I meant if the invoices are done on some kind of vehicle management software then often the data can be extracted via csv/excel from that software and imported direct into sage.

Proper sage - I mean sage 50 of some description, or even sage instant (rather than the useless oh so slow sage one - cloudy software! Dreadful stuff!! Guess you could say Im not a fan!)

Supply and fit - should have VAT on it as its a service they are supplying.

VAT would increase if their turnover in none MOTs is up so worth a question there. That or,of course, it is via errors in the bookkeeping. Or perhaps buying a lot from non VAT registered traders (ive seen some odd stuff with ebay purchases, although generally not enough to make that much of a dent!). Start with your own bill - does it look right? Maybe you could suggest you do an overview of their last VAT return for a fixed fee - then you can have a good nosey and they can have a mini audit on their VAT?

Good luck for your meeting - let us know how you get on!

Nikole · Senior Member

I have been contemplating getting the Cloud based Sage. I think ill hold back for now :/

My invoice has added vat for supply and fit. Didnt have the MOT carried out there so will have to have a nosey through there invoices. Great idea on offering to do a mini vat inspection. Im so thankful for this site and the help i get :)

Will let you know the outcome tomorrow.

Enjoy the rest of your evening and thanks for your help so far.

Lyndsey · Senior Member

Hi

I also find it difficult to price jobs without actually starting the work.

I had a call the other week which went along these lines...

"Hi how much do you charge for bookkeeping"
I gave my hourly rate
"how much monthly"
Well it really depends on what you require, how much work is involved etc
"its a off licence"
Is it VAT registered/limited company etc
"yes"
I explained that I can only offer bookkeeping up to tb for LTD and an accountant would have to do the return, and that it would be best to meet up to discuss further.
"ok thanks" and rung off....

I have just arranged one of my clients onto a fixed fee, I have worked with them for 18 months and they are very receptive to my advice and pretty organised.

If they are worried about your costs, you could explain the more organised and clear they are with the work they give you, the cheaper it will be. But I would stick to an hourly fee until you know how much work is actually involved.

I see these websites selling monthly bookkeeping for xx amount a month, I really don't know how they do that. I presume they are making a loss on some clients or they have a LOT of extra fee clauses.

Thanks Lyndsey

abacus12345 · Guru

For me fixed price is best. Self employed under VAT threshold, bookkeeping and tax return Â£600. Â£800 above. A trader turning over Â£150-Â£200k would be around Â£1200. (I have none that size!) If it was a shop or similar it would be higher, same with ebay and paypal. A shoe box would be the equivalent yearly rate - upfront. A garage wouldn't be cheap, for bookkeeping tax and payroll it would be over Â£1500, as by the sounds of it you're the finance officer - especially if the son is an accidental business owner.

Leger · Master Book-keeper

I go roughly by the amount of paperwork, and offer a monthly price, fixed for 6 months. I'm usually not that far out but will adjust up or down if I need to.

Only time I got it seriously wrong was when I worked for the equivalent of £5 an hour!!!

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

abacus12345 wrote:
For me fixed price is best. Self employed under VAT threshold, bookkeeping and tax return Â£600. Â£800 above. A trader turning over Â£150-Â£200k would be around Â£1200. (I have none that size!) If it was a shop or similar it would be higher, same with ebay and paypal. A shoe box would be the equivalent yearly rate - upfront. A garage wouldn't be cheap, for bookkeeping tax and payroll it would be over Â£1500, as by the sounds of it you're the finance officer - especially if the son is an accidental business owner.

Are you talking at crossed purposes here? Bookkeeping and tax return at the start. How often at that rate and what about their accounts? Im assuming you are talking an annual fee, although - the 'under the VAt threshold could mean you are well under pricing yourself depending on volume. Then I assume at the other end of your paragraph you are talking a monthly fee? But its not all that clear I dont think. Perhaps you can clarify, especially for the sake of Nicola given she is attending one today?

abacus12345 · Guru

Sorry - trying to avoid a massive block paragraph. Yes, bookkeeping, accounts and tax return - lowest fixed is Â£600 per year. T/O => Â£83K = Â£800. If there are high volume transactions, ebay/paypal reconciliations I'd be looking at adding an extra Â£25 per month. One years worth of receipts turning up for a self assassessment would be the same as the yearly fixed fee. For an equivalent ltd I'd have a view to charge Â£900 / Â£1200 respectively, If I dealt with. With fixed, as you become faster the more you will earn - hourly there are only so many hours you can work.

abacus12345 · Guru

My hourly now works out around Â£35 per hour worked. That is probably on the lower side of what some earn. It's hard to guage prices, on this forum folk do all the work, bookkeeping accounts and tax - on other forums folk complete the accounts and return, on many websites the price is for accounts and return, not bookkeeping. Adding in bookkeeping raises the price, so keep that in mind.

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

abacus12345 wrote:
Sorry - trying to avoid a massive block paragraph. Yes, bookkeeping, accounts and tax return - lowest fixed is Â£600 per year. T/O => Â£83K = Â£800. If there are high volume transactions, ebay/paypal reconciliations I'd be looking at adding an extra Â£25 per month. One years worth of receipts turning up for a self assassessment would be the same as the yearly fixed fee. For an equivalent ltd I'd have a view to charge Â£900 / Â£1200 respectively, If I dealt with. With fixed, as you become faster the more you will earn - hourly there are only so many hours you can work.

Sorry Johnny - I shouldve probably made myself clearer - it was the £1500 garage work that I thought needed clarification, assuming a monthly rather than annual fee given it includes the bookkeeping work?

Although I am assuming (and maybe incorrectly) that Nicola is doing purely bookkeeping and not teh Accounts work.

abacus12345 · Guru

He he - no problem :) I'll assume it's a limited due to it being a garage. Purely bookkeeping and payroll, I'll guess reasonable turnover due to having staff, VAT too, Â£800 fixed. An accountant would probably charge, for everything Â£2000.

VinceH · Expert

"rather than the useless oh so slow sage one - cloudy software! Dreadful stuff!!"

I've just been reading elsewhere that Sage have announced a price increase for Sage One - 50%, increasing it from £10 to £15 per month from 1st April.

Although looking on their site, I can't see either of those prices as such. The price for Sage One Accounting is given as "from £10 + VAT" but drilling down, it's actually £20 + VAT per month, discounted to £10 + VAT for the first three months.

I'm left wondering two things: Is the price increase for the first three months - and the subsequent price therefore also increasing to £30 + VAT per month? And is there going to be a similar price increase for other products?

Either way, given how awful Sage's cloudy offerings apparently are (I've never used it, so I can only go by others' opinions...) I'll stick with the desktop!

abacus12345 · Guru

Yep, aside from the actual limitations of the software it makes it difficult to fix a fee for a client with the cloud due to the price fluctuations of the sofrware. I think with cloud providers they wake up on a Wednesday, pick a price out the sky and roll a dice to decide how long the price will stay as is.

Leger · Master Book-keeper

A good point raised by Johnny and Vince. If cloud software pricing is going to change on a whim, then it's a cost that can't be controlled. It's going to have to be a fee that's charged separately (or the client paying the vendor direct) in my opinion and subject to price increases as and when.

abacus12345 · Guru

That's the issue I'm currently pondering, hence the VT cashbook and invoicing thread I created.

Losing £5 - £10 won't break the bank. But when you multiply that by each month, then by each client then well....

The idea of getting the client to subscribe personally to the cloud and you to link up with them is an appealing idea.

I have a fear within that mind, what if, for whatever reason, the client doesn't pay one month, cash inflows are late, they are running at a deficit for whatever reason (not an ideal client - yet still) and the provider locks you both out of the package, no data, no reporting can be done - can you imagine the amount of loopholes that will need covering in a letter of engagement!

So many angles to look at something which is supposedly simple and futuristic.

Nikole · Senior Member

Evening all,

Well i had my second meeting today with the owner present. I did not get to see any paperwork as the son had taken it all home ready to ship off the the bookkeeper so no closer to seeing how many sales/purchase invoices go through each month. I did have a good chat with them and stuck to my guns about an hourly rate and not being able to be more accurate unless i could see paperwork. With the current bookkeeper it isnt just about the pricing. They have a few issues with not receiving reports ect and incorrect vat returns and they feel the bookkeeper as become complacent.The bookkeeping is done manually in the good old ledger book and they now want to tighten up with the bookkeeping to prevent any mistakes which have been costly to them.

VinceH · Expert

"Well i had my second meeting today with the owner present. I did not get to see any paperwork as the son had taken it all home ready to ship off the the bookkeeper so no closer to seeing how many sales/purchase invoices go through each month."

Where do they keep their historical records? Surely the stuff that has been taken away for the current bookkeeper is all current - so they could have shown you the records from (say) the previous quarter?

It may be that this simply didn't occur to them (or you) - but make a mental note for future reference.

"With the current bookkeeper it isnt just about the pricing. They have a few issues with not receiving reports ect and incorrect vat returns and they feel the bookkeeper as become complacent."

Bear in mind that the problem could be with them - there's no way of knowing, for example (and I stress, this is just an example possibility), if the "incorrect VAT" and reports not being provided are a result of them not providing all of the paperwork that's needed. The bookkeeper might (rightly) be sticking to their guns and not reclaiming VAT when no VAT receipt has been provided - resulting in a VAT bill that's higher than it could be. The same problem could also lead to higher bills from the bookkeeper (an issue you mentioned in an earlier post) as a result of spending extra time trying to get that paperwork.

As I said, though, that's just an example. At the end of the day, if the problem is with them and not the bookkeeper, they're hardly likely to say "Yes, we want to replace the current bookkeeper because they're insisting on doing things properly, but we're not interested..."

Don't take anything at all for granted until you see that paperwork.

"The bookkeeping is done manually in the good old ledger book and they now want to tighten up with the bookkeeping to prevent any mistakes which have been costly to them."

Wait! What? The bookkeeper does things manually in a ledger book? Where did the company find him/her? In the 1970s?

Or is it them that's using the ledger, and the bookkeeper is given it in order to deal with the VAT and such like?

When I read this thread last night, a few things occurred to me about the problems you mentioned early in the thread - the increasing bookkeeping fees, and the VAT returns apparently being too high.

One of the possible cause of both, I've mentioned above.

Another is the manual invoicing you mentioned. In my experience, when a company like that does their invoicing manually, on paper, there will be frequent mistakes - they're usually done by any one of a number of people (in this case, probably whoever in the garage does the job) and different people have different abilities and failings. You'll inevitably find mistakes on invoices - incorrect totals, VAT worked out at the wrong percentage, or just an 'approximate' figure used are just the tip of the iceberg. You'll probably also find instances where invoices have been amended, and you can't be certain they were amended before being separated from the carbon copy. Then you have different people's handwriting to contend with.

Leading on from that, tying up money received with the actual invoices can be 'interesting' (read: time consuming).

Messed up invoices could lead to their VAT bills being higher than expected - and for all the reasons above, could also lead to their bookkeeper's fees being high. It becomes a lot of work to deal with.

This is something you want to change right off the bat - get them to use some kind of invoicing software. I had a company in a similar situation, and in their case I *wrote* a piece of software specific to their needs - I concluded at the time that if they had something more generic, and configurable, they'd mess up the config! Now, I take the CSV file from my software and import it into Sage.

There's still the problem of tying up a huge number of invoices to monies received, and I 'take a view' on it (otherwise I'd be there all day, every day, and still not have enough time). My solution is to import all the invoices to Joe Public into a single sales ledger account. I go through the bank statements and paying in books, and anything identifiable from those are allocated to specific invoices - which also ensures that (for example) an insurance payout isn't treated as sales - and then anything else, which basically means credit card receipts, are allocated en masse.

This could also be an area where the existing bookkeeper is doing things wrongly - if those invoices are as inadequate as I suspect they might be, he might simply be treating all money into the bank as sales: Which might therefore mean he's not taking into account that there are MOT tests, with no VAT. (Err... I'm not going back over the thread to check now, but I think you said it's an MOT place?)

So, like I said, if you take it on, get that invoicing computerised as a top priority. (Convince them that doing so will bring their costs down - and also make their invoices look more professional!)

Given the environment, though (and though I dislike Cloud) I'd make sure that the invoicing data is (automatically) backed up to something like Dropbox, which is shared with you.

And, of course, you'll want to computerise the accounts and move them into the 1980s - but that probably goes without saying! ;)

Nikole · Senior Member

The bookkeeper stores all of the companies records at their premises for a monthly fee. I did ask the owner on Friday if they could have February's paperwork ready for my meeting today. Lack of communication between father and son has meant no paperwork to run through.

The company incurred a large fine as the bookkeeper had missed 2 pages out of the ledger when preparing the vat return. I did advise the owner that ideally he needs to at least check the vat return against his records from now on.

I have advised them to source some software that will enable them to prduce an invoice and i have also mentioned that some software may even feed the invoices to accounting software. MOT's are invoiced on a seperate line and do not include any vat. There is definately room for improvement with this company and i dare say fault does lie with both parties.

Credit card receipts are entered amass and so are purchase invoices. The company are a cash accounting scheme so is the bookkeeper just entering into the ledger the total amount paid.

There is definately lots to consider and i certainly wont be rushing into anything.

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

Manual bookkeeping - no wonder their charges are high. Agree with all of Vince's comments and was thinking along the same lines.

First thing to keep their costs down - get all the paperwork back and stop paying someone else a storage fee.

Are you taking this one on then/have they agreed you should take over?

Get them to look at something like VGM for the invoicing. There are some really crappy garage management software bits out there - was warned off one last year but cant recall now what its called (will try to remember!)

Lots come to mind to sort this one out - its easy but the start will be painful (and costly whilst you get them up and running!)

One question - when you say cash accounting - do you mean VAT cash accounting? If so - WTF??

If they have a receptionist who does the invoices - you need to get their buy in for any changes and get them on board re cash v credit card/debit card v cheques v bacs payments for the invoices - the rest will then fall into place.

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

Cynci - moi?!! Wonder what they were hiding when the son took the paperwork off the premises knowing you were on the way!!!!! Weird or what.

Bet you anything they dont want to pay for any kind of improvements. Get their buyin BEFORE you start!

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

abacus12345 wrote:
He he - no problem :) I'll assume it's a limited due to it being a garage. Purely bookkeeping and payroll, I'll guess reasonable turnover due to having staff, VAT too, Â£800 fixed. An accountant would probably charge, for everything Â£2000.

You could be doing yourself out of a LOT of money that way!

I have one of these and neither figure comes close Im afraid. I dont even do the payroll which would shove it up a fair old bit more.

Rather than having an almost one price fits all, consider the volume and any erm, lets say 'complexities' that dis-organised entrepeneurs bring with them!

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

VinceH wrote:
"rather than the useless oh so slow sage one - cloudy software! Dreadful stuff!!"
I've just been reading elsewhere that Sage have announced a price increase for Sage One - 50%, increasing it from £10 to £15 per month from 1st April.
Although looking on their site, I can't see either of those prices as such. The price for Sage One Accounting is given as "from £10 + VAT" but drilling down, it's actually £20 + VAT per month, discounted to £10 + VAT for the first three months.
I'm left wondering two things: Is the price increase for the first three months - and the subsequent price therefore also increasing to £30 + VAT per month? And is there going to be a similar price increase for other products?
Either way, given how awful Sage's cloudy offerings apparently are (I've never used it, so I can only go by others' opinions...) I'll stick with the desktop!

It doesnt seem that long since it was bounced up from £10 to £20pm (+VAT). I seem to recall a cash book version, so reckon that might the lower end fee. They should give you a refund for it being so flamin slow and clunky.

Johnny - easy solution (and one I think Mark does if I have it right) - you pay the fees for the software (so you retain control) but pass them on each month in your invoice (stating any increases....blur blur blur). Something like that - have a search round for Mark's posts in this regard.

abacus12345 · Guru

Fair play if you take this on, could be interesting.

Charge through the roof though, sounds like it could be a bumpy ride.

I'd 100% make sure you send [as i'm sure you always do] a professional clearance letter - me thinks it is the bookkeeper doing the sacking.

abacus12345 · Guru

I've always had issues trying to form reasonable, realistic figures.

I obviously want to earn as much as I possibly can, whilst still being competitive.

Pricing is tricky!

Nikole · Senior Member

Cheshire wrote:
Manual bookkeeping - no wonder their charges are high - I have stipulated that I wont be doing any manual bookkeeping and they have welcomed my idea along with purchasing some software to enable them to generate the invoice electronically.

Are you taking this one on then/have they agreed you should take over? - The chances of me taking over are very high. I have advised them to have a think about my charges and if they're happy then go about things the right way with there current bookkeeper and ensure they give sufficient notice. Someone mentioned a letter of clearance which is on my list of things to do.

Get them to look at something like VGM for the invoicing. There are some really crappy garage management so out there - was warned off one last year but cant recall now what its called (will try to remember!) - I have had a look at VGM. I think it would be ideal and you can export to Sage which I think might be a good selling point to them :)

Lots come to mind to sort this one out - its easy but the start will be painful (and costly whilst you get them up and running!) -

One question - when you say cash accounting - do you mean VAT cash accounting? If so - WTF?? - Yes VAT Cash accounting. Is this not good?

If they have a receptionist who does the invoices - you need to get their buy in for any changes and get them on board re cash v credit card/debit card v cheques v bacs payments for the invoices - the rest will then fall into place. - No receptionist to convince as the son does all of the invoicing so that's one less hurdle.

I think they are quite relieved that they will eventually become computer based for their invoicing/accounts. I have thrown a few money saving ideas at them which grabbed their attention so I think after a rocky start everything will then run smoothly. "She prays"

I am quite looking forward to a challenge and gaining another client. I had to turn down two very large payrolls at the beginning of the year because the timing wasn't right and I am now in a position to take on a little more work.

-- Edited by Nikole on Tuesday 7th of March 2017 09:39:27 PM

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

Sounds like you have a busy time ahead and that's great news for you. I love setting systems up from scratch.

Well done you.

I would suggest (probably without recommending) VGM to them, but let them have a look round in conjunction with you, at what else is available. (Still cannot recall the name of the one I was told was rubbish....it will come back to me eventually! It's an age thing, so I've charmingly been told!!)

Re the vat cash accounting, it's usually useful as it aids cashflow, delays the payment of vat until they are in receipt of cash from customers so is more useful to those businesses who provide long credit to their clients. This is essentially a cash based business so they would derive no benefit. If they are then pushing to extend credit with their suppliers then they would be creating an issue with cash flow as they then cannot claim the vat back on purchases until they are paid. Although in that industry suppliers are generally pretty keen and swift on their credit control so I wouldn't expect more than a couple of months worth of invoices to be outstanding at any one time, if that.

So either the information is incorrect and its standard vat accounting, or there is something else going on that resulted in this moving to standard that we are not aware about.

Nikole · Senior Member

Hiya Vat cash accounting came from the son so I might confirm this is correct with the owner. I guess I will know a lot more about the business very soon. Thank you for your help (Thank you to other responses too)

Lyndsey · Senior Member

Wow I didn't think anyone did manual bookkeeping anymore! This garage sounds very similar to one of my hubby's clients/friends. I've always thought I would like to get my teeth into their books I do love a good reconciliation. I used to do major recs at my old career in Securities Global Custodians. But I've never offered as I don't have the time at the minute and can of worms...

When working with these types for usineessses make sure they listen to you and take on advice in helping theme organise themselves. I would explain I couldn't give a fixed fee until everything is sorted and work on an hourly rate until they are organised. You don't want to offer and fee and find the work taking 10 times longer

Lyndsey

Nikole · Senior Member

My ex boss was very old school. Everything was entered into the sales day book cash book then into the ledgers. 800 sales invoices and 500 purchase invoices each month to enter each month used to take me a very long time. I've still got a callous on my finger from gripping the pen.