MLR price increase - The Book-keepers Forum (UK)

Artois · Guru

MLR price increase

Leger · Master Book-keeper

Someone needs to tell HMRC that inflation isn't running at 11.5%!

£40 to check whether a person has an unspent conviction? Someone's having a giraffe.

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

Hi Doug
Thanks, on behalf of everyone on the site, for the heads up.

Hi John
When are you starting the petition?

Its just a money making exercise ......AGAIN!!!!!!!!!!

Kinbuck · Senior Member

Hi Doug (& fellow Inmates) I renewed in January at the increased fee. I hadn't heard about the approvals test charge and I wasn't asked for it. I was already shaking my fists at the price rise and the amount of time the new application took so would have been really hacked off if they'd been extra charges!!

Artois · Guru

Kinbuck wrote:
Hi Doug (& fellow Inmates) I renewed in January at the increased fee. I hadn't heard about the approvals test charge and I wasn't asked for it. I was already shaking my fists at the price rise and the amount of time the new application took so would have been really hacked off if they'd been extra charges!!

Hi Janet

Did you not receive an email about the new approvals test?

Ive still got the email and just had another read and it does say the charge will only be for businesses not previously subject to fit and proper testing (which means me) did you do a fit and proper test before? maybe this is why, if not and they have not asked for you to do the approvals test then Happy days.

Has anyone else had to pay for this new test?

I do not need to renew until April so will find out then

Cheers

Leger · Master Book-keeper

Hi Doug I don't think HMRC are taking the approval process fee straight away at the moment, but will let you know when, so you can then log in and pay for it. However it looks like Janet has received her renewal, so she's possibly not been charged the fee. Well done Janet if that's the case.

Kinbuck · Senior Member

Hi Doug & John

I've just checked my account and it's still 'decision pending' so maybe they'll catch up with me but I didn't get an email...obviously don't like me :(

Leger · Master Book-keeper

When did you re-register Janet? It's supposed to take about 45 days, but I read on aweb yesterday that one guy had been waiting 3 months, which is frankly ridiculous.

Kinbuck · Senior Member

32 days ago John so I've got a bit longer to wait which ever timeline they're working to ð

Artois · Guru

I renewed today and they only took the £130 for this and not the approval fee, does say it can take up to 45 days to be accepted but I suspect it is as John said that they will charge you after.

Hi Janet, have you had your renewal confirmed yet?

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

Have I asked this before Doug? How come you aren't licenced via the AAT?

Artois · Guru

Cheshire wrote:
Have I asked this before Doug? How come you aren't licenced via the AAT?

Hi Joanne

I never applied to become a member after passing Level 4, was never really concerned about having the letters after my name

Bucks Bodger · Senior Member

Hi everyone

I got an email from HMRC today (my MLR registration is due for renewal on 1st July).

I'm a bit confused by it as it tells me to log on to my MLR account and update my information to make
sure all persons are recorded (there's only me!). So I logged on, but there seemed to be no way
of telling them that I had checked everything and there was no update necessary (none of the info
has changed since I first registered). And even if I had updated anything, I couldn't see how to
"save and submit the update" as per their instructions.

As I understand it, HMRC will check the info given and then send me a bill for £40 (marvellous - more expense!)
and then carry out the approvals test.

Just not sure it will happen as they suggest it should!

I rang the MLR helpline and was told to click the button on the website asking for help and someone will
contact me. Not holding my breath for that one!

Has anyone else had this email and successfully updated?

Eunice

Artois · Guru

Hi Eunice

I got the same email, however I have already applied for renewal on 12th April and my account is still showing Decision Pending, I am the same as you and work alone, from what I gathered when I filled in the renewal the approval test fees will be taken at a later date.

Maybe you can only submit an update if you make a change to the responsible persons section (only a guess)

Kinbuck · Senior Member

Bucks Bodger wrote:
Hi everyone

I got an email from HMRC today (my MLR registration is due for renewal on 1st July).

I'm a bit confused by it as it tells me to log on to my MLR account and update my information to make
sure all persons are recorded (there's only me!). So I logged on, but there seemed to be no way
of telling them that I had checked everything and there was no update necessary (none of the info
has changed since I first registered). And even if I had updated anything, I couldn't see how to
"save and submit the update" as per their instructions.

As I understand it, HMRC will check the info given and then send me a bill for £40 (marvellous - more expense!)
and then carry out the approvals test.

Just not sure it will happen as they suggest it should!

I rang the MLR helpline and was told to click the button on the website asking for help and someone will
contact me. Not holding my breath for that one!

Has anyone else had this email and successfully updated?

Eunice

Hi Eunice/Doug

I got this email yesterday too. I applied for my renewal on 12th Jan - I paid the £130 fee but didn't know anything about the £40 fee and it never came up while I was completing it. I contacted them after 45 days to ask why the decision was 'still pending' and the reply was 'it can take up to 45 days to complete'!!!! I was rather aggravated by this...but now I'm raging!!!

I've just been in to the account (why did we have to have a separate account for this?!) The only thing I could see to do was to review/update each section. I don't remember the section asking about previous supervision (poor memory for some things). It said it wasn't completed so I entered required details and now it says I have to pay £130 again!!! I don't bloomin well think so disbelief How could I have got to the stage of paying the fee in January If I hadn't completed the application completely!!! And no mention of the £40 fee!

Sorry for all the !!! marks. Needed to get that off my chest

smile

Artois · Guru

Hi Janet

Read your post so I went into my account and the same thing happened to me, this NEW supervision section had suddenly appeared and when I filled it in they wanted to charge because I had made changes even though my main screen says the application was complete, so left them an email but don't suppose I will get a reply, will try and phone them tomorrow and let you know the outcome.

Edit to add

Just noticed as well that my application submission date has changed from 12th April to the 22nd May because I went into it, they really are having a laugh!!!

-- Edited by Artois on Tuesday 22nd of May 2018 08:55:20 PM

Kinbuck · Senior Member

Artois wrote:

Hi Janet
Read your post so I went into my account and the same thing happened to me, this NEW supervision section had suddenly appeared and when I filled it in they wanted to charge because I had made changes even though my main screen says the application was complete, so left them an email but don't suppose I will get a reply, will try and phone them tomorrow and let you know the outcome.

Edit to add
Just noticed as well that my application submission date has changed from 12th April to the 22nd May because I went into it, they really are having a laugh!!!

-- Edited by Artois on Tuesday 22nd of May 2018 08:55:20 PM

My date changed to 22nd too! I didn't email as I was too hacked off but will contact them later (probably Thurs). Will be interested to hear what they say to you.

My original application had said still pending...that's a long time to make a decision seeing as the money went out of my account on 12th Jan!

Cheers

Artois · Guru

Hi Janet

Phoned them this morning and explained what had happened and was told that the email sent out by HMRC was a generic one for all the people that they supervise, I know us two and Eunice have received them but would be interested to hear if others have received them and what they have done, I did check last night on the website and I am still showing on the HMRC supervision list.

I was told that as long as my status screen is showing pending then the application is still being renewed and if there was anything else they needed then they would be back in contact, they did say that my payment was not showing against my account but that could be an error on their part, I told her I had all the payment details and reference number and she told me to email them and they will get it sorted, on the 45 days that they quote apparently this is for new applications and renewals can take longer but no time limit.

I also received a reply to last nights email and I have sent them a screenshot of my status page to see what they have to say, so will wait and see.

So it seems that the application is still pending and no further fees are required from what I have been told.

Might still be worth giving them a ring as I have found with HMRC that you get conflicting answers depending on who you speak to.

Kinbuck · Senior Member

Thanks for that Doug, I ran out of time to contact them today so probably next week before I do. Never thought to check the register to see if I was still there...and I am biggrin

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

The MLR app is the naffest app on their website and boy do they have some naff naff ones.

If you go in to check something you can easily push it to look like you are re-applying. Then I think (might be wrong) that the clock starts re-ticking. Sure Ive got an email about such from them from when they introduced it!

I too got that email and my bloody MLR expired with them a while back (deliberate).

They cannot just take another £40 from your debit card without giving authorisation so not quite sure how thats gonna work.

Suggestion, for what its worth - dont phone them (they have denyability) - go through the email/send a message box option on the screen itself - keep a screen shot. To be fair they are usually quite swift at getting back on that score, just slow slow slow on renewals and new MLR bits.

PS - Janet - good to hear the new job is going well! Do you still need MLR? (just a thought!)

Artois · Guru

Cheshire wrote:
Suggestion, for what its worth - dont phone them (they have denyability) - go through the email/send a message box option on the screen itself - keep a screen shot. To be fair they are usually quite swift at getting back on that score, just slow slow slow on renewals and new MLR bits.

Hi Joanne

I did email them and they were got back to me the next day asking for screenshots of my status page which I sent, they replied that someone was working on it and the was the last I heard.

Havn't seen you on here for a while I thought you had deserted us

Leger · Master Book-keeper

Cheshire wrote:
The MLR app is the naffest app on their website and boy do they have some naff naff ones.

If you go in to check something you can easily push it to look like you are re-applying. Then I think (might be wrong) that the clock starts re-ticking. Sure Ive got an email about such from them from when they introduced it!

I too got that email and my bloody MLR expired with them a while back (deliberate).

They cannot just take another £40 from your debit card without giving authorisation so not quite sure how thats gonna work.

Suggestion, for what its worth - dont phone them (they have denyability) - go through the email/send a message box option on the screen itself - keep a screen shot. To be fair they are usually quite swift at getting back on that score, just slow slow slow on renewals and new MLR bits.

Hi Joanne, ggod to see your cheery self again, I was wondering about you yesterday and noticed you MIA. Hopefully sunning yourself on a Caribbean Island biggrin

I'm having issues myself at the moment and they are taking over two weeks to respond an email. I have misplaced my mlr gateway login and the only way to contact them is via a unique email address. I got a response after 16 days saying they need my permission to send me an email with my details. Yeah like I wouldn't have sent an email in the first place if I didn't need it would I? So I now have to wait another 16 days for the next response.

Once they're ready to take the £40 they will contact you, and you log in and pay it, that's how I understand it any way.

Go on I'm nosy so spill the beans on why you've deliberately let your MLR expire, is it good news qualification wise or have you ditched accountancy for summat else?

Kinbuck · Senior Member

Cheshire wrote:
Suggestion, for what its worth - dont phone them (they have denyability) - go through the email/send a message box option on the screen itself - keep a screen shot. To be fair they are usually quite swift at getting back on that score, just slow slow slow on renewals and new MLR bits.

PS - Janet - good to hear the new job is going well! Do you still need MLR? (just a thought!)

Morning Joanne

I'll go with emailing them and see what they have to say about it all.

I'm keeping some of my private clients so thought I would still need my own MLR? I was speaking to one of the other 'associates' the other day and she said she's never been covered for MLR other than through the practice although she does private clients too blankstare

Artois · Guru

Kinbuck wrote:

I'm keeping some of my private clients so thought I would still need my own MLR? I was speaking to one of the other 'associates' the other day and she said she's never been covered for MLR other than through the practice although she does private clients too

Hi Janet

I maybe wrong but I can not see why the other 'associate' would not have to be covered by MLR if she is engaged by private clients to carry out accounting or bookkeeping work then this would be her own business and nothing to do with the practice and therefore it should be registered, unless maybe she is covered by a supervising body.

I would have thought that she would only be covered through the practice for their clients, might be worth getting her to find out more because if it does come to light later that she has been carrying out work without being supervised it may turn out to be rather costly.

Leger · Master Book-keeper

Artois wrote:
I maybe wrong but I can not see why the other 'associate' would not have to be covered by MLR if she is engaged by private clients to carry out accounting or bookkeeping work then this would be her own business and nothing to do with the practice and therefore it should be registered, unless maybe she is covered by a supervising body.

Definitely not wrong Doug, unless she's a member of ICB, IAB, AAT etc and covered under that body.

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

Leger wrote:

Hi Joanne, ggod to see your cheery self again, I was wondering about you yesterday and noticed you MIA. Hopefully sunning yourself on a Caribbean Island

Ahhh, thanks John, but no not cheery, given up being cheery! confuse biggrin No to the Caribbean Island as well - later this year hopefully! Did head down to the South West for a while, but not on a break (dying for one of those).

OMG losing your gateway login!!! Did the email you get back also say you take full responsibility (with added other doom and gloom) for the emails they send you. Love the denyability (again) of that bunch of clowns! With the note they can post it to you instead - might be quicker!

Im registered for AML elsewhere now (that would be telling!) but have also been offered a job by a client. He hasnt fully scoped it out yet (or if he has, he hasnt given me the detail, just gauging my interest at this stage, in part up to me I guess).

Janet - you will need to keep MLR reg for the private clients and yes Doug is correct that the lady at the accountants needs it for herself as well (be it under HMRC or as John says one of the supervising bodies). Show her the links/notes on here about the mega fines as well as prison possibilities (and expulsion/fines from one of the supervising bodies if they find out she hasnt got it). Im afraid there are LOTS of folks who probably havent got it (one on here a few weeks ago at least) and will try to claim ignorance of the law if they are ever caught. I also hope her boss knows she does work outside the office otherwise she could be in breach of contract.

Leger · Master Book-keeper

Cheshire wrote:
Leger wrote:

Hi Joanne, ggod to see your cheery self again, I was wondering about you yesterday and noticed you MIA. Hopefully sunning yourself on a Caribbean Island

Ahhh, thanks John, but no not cheery, given up being cheery! No to the Caribbean Island as well - later this year hopefully! Did head down to the South West for a while, but not on a break (dying for one of those).
OMG losing your gateway login!!! Did the email you get back also say you take full responsibility (with added other doom and gloom) for the emails they send you. Love the denyability (again) of that bunch of clowns! With the note they can post it to you instead - might be quicker!
Im registered for AML elsewhere now (that would be telling!) but have also been offered a job by a client. He hasnt fully scoped it out yet (or if he has, he hasnt given me the detail, just gauging my interest at this stage, in part up to me I guess).

Hi Joanne

Tell me about it. I normally screenshot these things but can't have done on this occasion. Yes the email did say I had to take full responsibility.

I was right (in my head) about the AML comment. Well done. And I hope the job offer goes the way you want.

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

Artois wrote:

Havn't seen you on here for a while I thought you had deserted us

Ha, no chance!

wink

Kinbuck · Senior Member

Leger wrote:
Artois wrote:
I maybe wrong but I can not see why the other 'associate' would not have to be covered by MLR if she is engaged by private clients to carry out accounting or bookkeeping work then this would be her own business and nothing to do with the practice and therefore it should be registered, unless maybe she is covered by a supervising body.
Definitely not wrong Doug, unless she's a member of ICB, IAB, AAT etc and covered under that body.

Thanks John, Doug & Joanne

I'd' suggested' she wasn't covered for private clients (politely), mentioned fines etc. ..wasn't happy Not sure about other bodies but have the impression not attached to anyone.

Bucks Bodger · Senior Member

Hi all

Still waiting for confirmation of my renewal, which I did on 4th June.

Useless!

Eunice

Leger · Master Book-keeper

Send them an email Eunice, you'll get a reply back in 16 days!!

Artois · Guru

Bucks Bodger wrote:
Still waiting for confirmation of my renewal, which I did on 4th June.

Useless!

I forgot all about this, but just checked and my account is still showing 'Pending' and I applied on April 12th!

Useless seems very kind disbelief

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

Artois wrote:
Bucks Bodger wrote:
Still waiting for confirmation of my renewal, which I did on 4th June. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Useless!
I forgot all about this, but just checked and my account is still showing 'Pending' and I applied on April 12th! Double !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Useless seems very kind

Ive had an email warning of dire consequences of not having MLR, after I let my HMRC cover lapse (Im with a prof body). Also just received a letter this week to state that it appears many folk are having trouble logging in and here is how you can get in/re-set your password etc. They want me to update my records - but given its expired there is nothing that will allow an update. There is also no phone number on the letter!!!!!

I feel an email complaint coming on!

VinceH · Expert

They had a complaint from me the other day.

This actually relates to the £40 fee Doug mentioned. I had an email the other day informing me I had a new message - when I logged in it was because I hadn't paid the £40, and I needed to pay it ASAP.

So I did so there and then... but instead of being directed to a confirmation page after making the payment, I got "this page can't be found" - with a link in case of an error, which said "this page can't be found" - which a link in case of an error, which said "this page can't be found" - etc.

I went back to the account page and found a feedback form, and used that to let them know what I think.

With no confirmation on their site, no confirmation email, and no indication in the account about payments made, I can't tell if the payment happened until I see it on my bank account, which could take a few days.

Brilliant.

Artois · Guru

I think HMRC must read the BKN forum as I received an email from them earlier today in response to the query that I sent on May 22nd about my renewal saying

'Your application has been received, together with your premise fee of £130, the relevant team will email you once your application is fully processed'

Hopefully I will get this before it needs renewing again FFS!

Shamus · Forum Moderator & Expert

Bucks Bodger wrote:
Hi all

Still waiting for confirmation of my renewal, which I did on 4th June.

Useless!

Eunice

Still waiting for mine from 12 months ago Eunice!

Thankfully this year I won't be renewing with them.

Jay · Senior Member

We had a similar email some time ago. Whilst you can contact them by telephone it is for general advice and not to discuss your registration.

I emailed them advising that I could see no reason for the £40 fee and received the following response some weeks later :

Thank you for your email . If you dont need to add a responsible person or make any other updates to your online account you can ignore the email.

BW

Jay

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

Interesting Jay!

I never saw anything about this when I was with HMRC (up to end April). What was the £40 for anyway? An approvals 'test'? Has anyone done the test?

Leger · Master Book-keeper

Shamus wrote:
Still waiting for mine from 12 months ago Eunice!
Thankfully this year I won't be renewing with them.

Does that mean congratulations are in order Shaun? I'm assuming that means you've passed the supervisory part and are now fully ACCA

Jay · Senior Member

The email we received in May was as follows

BW Jay

Dear customer,

The Money Laundering Regulations 2017 (MLRs) introduced new rules relating to the approval of sole proprietors, beneficial owners, officers and managers.

What does this mean?

For Accountancy Service Providers, Estate Agency Businesses and High Value Dealers the main requirements are set out in Regulation 26 of the MLRs.

These prevent a person with convictions listed in Schedule 3 of the MLRs from being a sole proprietor, beneficial owner, officer or manager.

Details on the requirements, convictions and guidance on the approvals test and who this applies to can be found on GOV.UK.

What do I need to do?

You should review your GOV.UK anti money laundering supervision (AMLS) account to ensure that all beneficial owners, officers and relevant managers are included, so approval tests can be carried out by HMRC.

Please note, there is a £40 fee per person for the test.

To process this you will need to:

log into your online AMLS account
check and update the Responsible Persons section to include all relevant individuals
save and submit the update
in due course HMRC will send you an email advising you to log into your account for details on payment
once payment is received HMRC will carry out the approvals test
HMRC will only notify you if further information is required or an individual fails the test.

You have until Monday25June to ensure that all relevant persons in your business have applied for the test. Failure to do so will mean your anti-money laundering supervision will be invalid.

-- Edited by Jay on Monday 20th of August 2018 09:23:02 AM

Shamus · Forum Moderator & Expert

Leger wrote:
Shamus wrote:
Still waiting for mine from 12 months ago Eunice!
Thankfully this year I won't be renewing with them.
Does that mean congratulations are in order Shaun? I'm assuming that means you've passed the supervisory part and are now fully ACCA

I am indeed thanks John biggrin .... But now, but for a couple of small clients which just about cover my practice costs, I seem to be spending all of my time back working in corporate! .

Sure that eventually I'll manage to get all of my ducks in a row.... At least now there is nothing stopping me offering accounting services except for the constraints of the time I have available.

many thanks again,

all the best,

Shaun.

Artois · Guru

Shamus wrote:
I am indeed thanks John .... But now, but for a couple of small clients which just about cover my practice costs, I seem to be spending all of my time back working in corporate! .

Congratulations Shaun

Kinbuck · Senior Member

Morning everyone

I've still not got mine sorted from January!!! I emailed them again on 1st August detailing the whole saga and not had a response. Think I'll add this to the 'To do' list for this afternoon.

I've not done the test Joanne.

Congratulations Shaun - on-wards and upwards :)

VinceH · Expert

AFAICS, it's not a test you "do" - it's a background check covering a number of areas.

Leger · Master Book-keeper

That's right Vince, it's to ensure that a person with unspent criminal convictions related to dishonesty or fraud etc, are not allowed to be a beneficial owner or responsible position related to money laundering procedures.

Everyone had to mark this on their online account by 25th June 2018, and HMRC would then run background checks and charge you £40.00.

Joanne, you should have had to do this with your professional body, who I think are using an independent verification firm to do the criminal checks. From memory it was a soft DBS check, which only discloses unspent convictions.

Leger · Master Book-keeper

Shamus wrote:
John: Does that mean congratulations are in order Shaun? I'm assuming that means you've passed the supervisory part and are now fully ACCA
I am indeed thanks John .... But now, but for a couple of small clients which just about cover my practice costs, I seem to be spending all of my time back working in corporate! .
Sure that eventually I'll manage to get all of my ducks in a row.... At least now there is nothing stopping me offering accounting services except for the constraints of the time I have available.

Yay Shaun, well done mate

Cheshire · Master Book-keeper

I must admit my response was a bit tongue in cheek over someone having to take a test (lets face it HMRC dont seem to bother with such!) and did wonder if it was the fit and proper test, or what I prefer to call ''lets just rob you of another 40 quid, this one for a DBS check which any man off the street can get for £25 and such large organisations can get it for peanuts due to their buying power''. More money for old rope.

You are correct John in that the prof bodies are getting someone to do this independently and it is the most basic check. I already have an enhanced DBS due to my role with charity. Plus Ive signed the Official Secrets Act due a connection with the Ministry of Defence (and you only get to do that when you have a triple gilt edged DBS on you and all your immediate family) so you can imagine the choice words I used when they tried to rob me of my hard earned dosh. biggrin

Well done again Shaun. Much deserved. Now get back out of Corporate before the bad weather sets in (to avoid the commute if nothing else!) and get setting up that practice. Once you have your minions in place you can go back to Corporate life again (although Im so glad Im out of it, tempting though it is sometimes!) Besides you are needed back on here.

Shamus · Forum Moderator & Expert

cheers for the congratulations people. Must admit that at times it felt as though it was never going to happen :)

It was with a big grin on my face that last night I deregistered online from HMRC MLR supervision.

Artois · Guru

Got an email earlier today inviting me to give my views on the way HMRC charges fees for MLR, not sure if everyone governed by them has received this but here is the link if you would like to have a read

https://www.gov.uk/government/consultations/anti-money-laundering-supervision-discussion-about-fees

Not had a chance to have a proper look yet but judging from some of the posts on this thread some of you may wish to share your thoughts with HMRC

Leger · Master Book-keeper

I got the email as well Doug, thought immediately of this thread.

I will be responding smile