I'm new to bookkeeping, I was recently made redundant from a large company and my job role involved some business segment analysis - the local careers (for us over 35's) service advised me to do a basic course in a few different areas at my local college in Dundee and then decide what I might like to do next !!!
So I've now completed a "foundation" bookkeeping course at my local college and was wondering if any of you out there can help me decide my next step ?
is there any difference between ICB, IAB and AAT ? I have got a part-time job in a small practice (about 8 hours a week) doing basic ledger entries, and thought I might like to set up on my own in the near future.
Does any of the legislation affect me ? if so what ? and how would I go about complying ?
sorry it's a lengthy entry but I'm a little confused
Firstly I'd like to say the work you have in a practice - brilliant. Considering how valuable experience is, and that you have done a basic course you are already on the right path IMHO.
I would think the next step may be if you can find some of your own clients to handle the basic processing, possibly with support from the practice you are with. Just see if there may be opportunities through your contacts, and take it slow and steady.
As for legislation - there is nothing to prevent you from providinga bookkeeping service... though it is in your interest as well as your clients only to provide services you can provide (though possibly with support). Of course there are MLR (Money Laundering Regulations), Data Protection Act and a lot more you have to consider, but these won't prevent you from providing services though you may have some registrations and processes to deal with.
I'm not too familiar with ICB or IAB but some others here have been with AAT, and I've seen some BPP books floating around the office at times. From the little I know on this, I do think AAT is an excellent way to go as it is often a solid stepping stone to CIMA or ACCA (or simply a good qualification in itself).
As no qualification is really needed, and experience is just as important (if not more so), I'd say if you're going to spending time to get a qualification look at something that will put you in good stead - longterm!
Anything else I (or others) might help with?
It might help to search on this in these and other forums - I know I've answered much the same questions plenty of times and there is a lot - and people that have made the decisions and can probably provide you with what they think now!
I agree with everything John says..most people starting off in bookkeeping would give anything for that bit of experience before starting out on their own. I'm qualified with the ICB; I chose to go down the bookkeeping route as I have no intention of training to be an accountant
Look at what you want to do long term..if you want to go into accounting then the AAT is the best option, and as John says, it is an excellent stand alone qualification. Dont rush into buying the first bookkeeping course you see advertised..some of them are an out and out rip off! There always be someone on this forum who can give you an idea of which course providers offer best VFM.
I am a bookkeeper with a bookkeeping qualification from the ICB and I have been using this forum for a while now and find it very informative and helpful.
I recently have noticed that when someone uses the forum to enquire about becoming a bookkeeper and what qualifications are needed that some responses, such as the one given on this thread seem to indicate that a person can get into bookkeeping without a formal qualification. Whilst i do appreciate this is the case and indeed there are many people who do bookkeeping without a formal qualification and do it very well, i find that this type of reply fairly depressing to be honest.
A bookkeepers job is a very responsible one and it invariably is the work that is done by bookkeepers that an accountant works on to do year end etc.... so to even hint that someone can get into bookkeeping without qualifications devalues the profession i feel.
I know there are people out there who have no formal qualifications, have been doing the job for years and would probably be able to show me a thing or two, its just that when someone specifically comes onto this forum and asks about qualification, and the reply to include "no qualification is really needed" just makes me angry.
Scott, i can see you have experience which is a great start however do not underestimate the value of qualifications, i know from experience that potential employers and clients value them and will give you more confidence in your abilities.
I think when people say "You dont need any qualifications etc...", they're just stating a fact..you dont need any..unfortunately in my opinion. I agree that anyone, regardless of prior experience should only be able to call themselves a bookkeeper, or offer any kind of professional service unless they possess a relevant professional qualification. I think the thing that devalues the role of bookkeepers more than anything is cr*p work done by bookkeepers both qualified and unqualified. I think the time will come (soon I hope) when anyone offering a financial service of any kind will have to have belong to, have passed and hold a relevant organisation's certificates. I wouldn't go to anyone calling themselves a doctor unless I knew they were qualified...I think business people should take the same approach when looking for a bookkeeper...otherwise we have wasted our time and money bothering to get a professional qualification!
I'd really have to disagree on the qualifications with bookkeeping.
Of course having a qualification and being formally trained is better than not. Don't get me wrong, a qualification can certainly be worth having.
It is an industry with very little formally recognised as there are so many training courses/qualifications out there that cover bookkeeping and provide as adequate training as the qualifications mentioned in these forums.
Our own team are almost all university educated in accounting, and have had more training in the area of bookkeeping than these organisations would provide.
Then there are the 2 day, 2 week, 6 month courses on bookkeeping... where is the line drawn and how? A lot of the time spent by bookkeepers is simply data-entry, requiring little to no training. It is the other areas such as reconciling that may need some formal knowledge. I know many can also screw this up - but training often isn't what means it is done right - practical experience usually will though.
Accountancy is having it's own issues with this issue themselves, although they are have more professionally recognised bodies and clearer lines if it were to ever become a 'protected term'.
These also require experience in order to become qualified with these organisations - something that if bookkeeping were ever to be protected - it would also have to consider.
Having the certificate and done the training alone should never be considered a full qualification in itself. Unlike accounting where there is an enormous amount of theoretical and technical knowledge required - in bookkeeping there is much less and a short crash course may provide someone with the same bookkeeping knowledge required as a much longer course that involves more repetitive exercises.
Bookkeeping is also much less affected by legislation and changing laws - from country to country there are few differences, making it an even harder qualification to control. At best, a test and proven experience (but experienced along wise what qualified person - a bookkeeper?) might be enough to then class someone as 'qualified'.
After all that, knowing most company accounts are then also done, or at least looked over by an accountant... and if they aren't small accounts it needs to be someone qualified - and it is the owners/directors responsibility to ensure it is done correctly - there really isn't much point in even considering controlling a profession such as bookkeeping.
Qualifications are great - but this is an industry where most would consider experience far more important and valueable.
I am a little angry by your comments, i must admit. I do agree that bookkeeping is an area where someone can have a good career with no formal qualifications however your comment "there really isn't much point in even considering controlling a profession such as bookkeeping" i feel devalues what we do and i wonder what the ICB would make of your comments.
I am the sole person in the accounts department of a very important not for profit orgainisation in my local town and have to keep on top on the day to day accounts etc.. as well as providing information on the profitability of certain events, if we are on budget etc..... Whilst it could be said that doing this could be gained through experience, the ICB qualification provided me with the theoretical backgroud to understand what i was doing and why.
No doubt your team have all been to university and have degrees but a unversity degree also does not lead to all encompassing knowledge, i have 2 degrees myself and know that they do not provide all the knowledge required to apply to real life workplaces. I also feel that you are devaluing the work of organisations such as the ICB and IAB who strive hard to provide good solid qualifications and gain some sort of recognition for bookkeeping - which i feel from you comments may prove difficult. Are you suggesting that i wasted my time and money getting qualifications from the ICB, maybe i should have went to university to get an accounting degree instead.
The main reason i went for a qualification from the ICB was that i value what i do - even if you dont - and by gaining a qualification enables me provide added value to my employer, prove to them that i value what i do.
Please reflect on your comments given that you are posting on a bookkeepers forum. Sorry if i come across a bit strongly in my reply, i am a fairly placid person really but you have hit a raw nerve with me this time i'm afraid.
I hadn't intended to upset anyone, but the value or seriousness in a profession does not necessarily relate to having a need to control it.
Yes, it is better to have a qualification.
Yes, a qualification does hold value.
Yes, bookkeeping is something that requires knowledge and understanding and if not done right can be costly.
But those are not enough reasons to suggest controlling the term bookkeeper and who can operate in this position. I am sure the ICB and IAB appreciate this, and strive to show value in their members and the qualifications they hold - I'm currently unaware of any activity on their part to have the term bookkeeper protected.
My comments don't suggest any time is wasted in gaining qualifications or taking the time to study and learn the theory often needed in a chosen career path. I actually was saying this is useful - but shouldn't be used as a reason to control such an industry.
Based on your comments, it would suggest all professions that have some sort of qualification should have protection and controls as to who can consider themselves what. To me, that is simply unreasonable.
I have no intention in devaluing a qualification, so I am quite surprised and see no reason you or anyone else should be so offended. I don't think you should raise this one with accountants, office managers or any other profession that isn't currently protected, at the risk of being offended.
I've been running my book-keeping business for a few years now and I don't hold any professional qualifications. I was lucky enough to have an accountant friend who showed me the ropes, and this in my opinion was more valuable to me than spending time studying for a piece of paper.
I accept that there are qualifications I could take, but running a business and bringing up a family mean it is just not possible. It wouldn't make any difference to my clients who only care whether I meet their deadlines and ensure there books are up to scratch. I stick to what I know and turn away work that's too technical. I hold professional indemnity insurance, voluntarily attend CPD seminars and I'm regulated by HMRC for money laundering.
I am proud to call myself a book-keeper, and believe I should be judged on the service I provide to my clients and not what letters I have after my name.
Wendy, i am sorry if you think that i am valuing qualifications over experience, i am not and also agree with you that a bookkeepers work is not any better if they have qualifications after their name.
I started off in bookkeeping with no qualifications and only decided to take the ICB's exams after advice from a potential client who thought this may give me a bit more credibility. Also a friend went on a local business course and was advised by the business advisor to make sure the accoutant/bookkeepr they used was registered and qualified so i decided to take the exams for a number of reasons
1. To prove to my employer i was serious about what i was doing.
2. Any potential clients could be satisfied i was qualified, I found it difficult to get clients when i first started my business so i felt by gaining qualifications it would be easier as i didnt have word of mouth on my side.
Therefore Wendy please do not pick me up incorrectly, as i said in my previous replies, many bookkeepers do a good job without any qualifications and indeed i have come across people more knowledgeable than myself who have none, it was just in my situation, a qualification had benefits for me.
John, your last post talks about the protections of professions and i have to admit that i picked you up incorrectly on this one - i assumed you were talking about regulation whereas you were not so sorry about that. I do not have any issues about bookkeping not being protected, my issue is with the fact some posts on this and other financial forums do not seem to value qualifications as much as they should - surely having qualifications can only make bookkeeping more credible in the eyes of the wider public, however given the replies to my comments, i may be wrong.
Also John, i have been looking at this forum for a while and see that you do participate in threads quite often, giving good advice. On this occassion i felt the importance of qualifications were undervalued.
I have been training to be a Bookkeeper now for 5 Years: I have gained qualifications with Iab in all manual & computerised bookkeeping and Iab Payroll Manuall and currently studying Iab computerised 2 and 3. I have passed the majority with distinctions.
Experience: Short term work in Sales Ledger and Purchase Ledger for Ltd Companies, Worked for my husbands electrical contracting business for 3 Years and now work for an Accountant 3 Days a week.
I agree with with previous posts I would not be a competent bookkeeper and not even consider setting up my own buisness respectfully, without the balance of good qualifications which give you confidence in your working environment, a variety of Industry and experience . You cannot become a good Bookkeeper overnight and as stated on previous threads dont run before you can walk take your time and the rewards will come.
