Hi, starting from the bottom - any advice please? - The Book-keepers Forum (UK)

amz27 · Veteran Member

Hi, starting from the bottom - any advice please?

Alison · Senior Member

HI

In the accountancy and bookkeeping world experience and qualifications are important. Recognised bookkeeping exams are mainly IAB and ICB and for accountancy AAT (which is also recognised in bookkeeping) and ACCA and CIMA.

Would say that going self employed if you have the opportunity to do so to gain experience in a trainee position first for either an accountants firm or a large accounts department for a commercial company then that would make it easier for you to set up as self employed.

I know some people go straight from getting the qualifications without having the opportunity to gain experience first so it is possible this way but it may be harder to gain new clients as you get some clients who only care about experience, some clients who care equally about experience and qualifications and there are some who care about qualifications. In my experience I have found that they are mostly 2/3rd of them the first option and 1/3 of them the second option.

Alison

amz27 · Veteran Member

Hi alison, thank you for your reply.

So do you think doing a City & Guilds course is no good then? Is it any sort of recognised qualification? I suppose it would give me a starting off point and give me some experience, but am I wasting my money?

I have looked at an AAT course and it is way beyond my budget at the moment, I'm just a bit confused as to what to do!

Do City & Guilds courses count for anything then?

I understand what you mean about experience, I would definately consider a junior role for a few years maybe before attempting to go self employed.

I feel a bit defeated as I was really looking forward to this course but there is no point wasting my time and money on it if it doesnt count for anything.

Many thanks for your advice.

Amy

Alison · Senior Member

HI

AAT is so expensive.

Would say that City & Guilds would give you a starting point, maybe it is more recognised in other parts of the country, where are you based? In the North of England where I am if you are wanting to get a job they are mainly asking for AAT qualifications or if wanting to be self employed mainly IAB or ICB.

Would say that if you are looking forward to doing the course and it is within your budget then it is worth you doing it.

When I first started work when I was 17 my employer sent me on an RSA Bookkeeping course (which in reality is not that well known) but it gave me the starting point T Accounts etc so when 13 years after this I did the ICB qualifications made it that bit easier because I had done T Accounts and the basics then, I did not pay for the courses just went to one revision course then the exams (think without the RSA would have found this more difficult because course bookkeeping very different layout to the real life bookkeeping.

Alison

amz27 · Veteran Member

Hiya, thank you again for your reply.

I am in South West, Cornwall.

So if going down the self employed route, its better to do IAB or ICB rather than AAT?

I think I will still do the course, as it isnt to expensive and might give me some sort of head start if I do IAB or ICB after.

How did you find ICB? Are you working from home or in a job?

Thanks for your advice,

Amy

Alison · Senior Member

Hi

With self employed if you want to be a bookkeeper would say that best for IAB or ICB, but if you want to in the future become more accounts based would say AAT or if you want employment would be AAT. I know from reading forums that some people use the IAB or ICB as a stepping stone to the AAT, I have done that and when can afford it will do AAT.

I am changing from ICB tp IAB, I have found them unhelpful and rude (others have had no bother with them) basically because they took away job vacancies part unless you paid for particular letters after passing each exam and I told them that they should have warned people this was going to be happening which they did not and told me I was wrong to say that the most important reason I was a member of their institute was because of the job vacancies.

I used to be self employed working from home but in December 08 opened an internet/gaming cafe/IT franchise/and online bookshop so run all that at same time as bookkeeping in retail premises.

Alison

Terri · Senior Member

I think that Alison gave you loads of great advice. It might be worth looking for a job in bookkeeping or accounting while you study like she said. Experience does count for a lot in the bookkeeping field. I have qualifications but not a lot of experience and I have been struggling to win work, people seeming to pick experience over qualifications.

I am doing the ICB route and I am happy with it so far.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do and well done for making the leap to a different career. I was an insurance administrator/secretary before I started to training to be a bookkeeper and it's the best thing I ever did career wise.

Terri

amz27 · Veteran Member

Thanks for your replies, the information has been great and very interesting.

I think I need to sit down and decide what I really want to do first, more on the accounting side or veer towards bookkeeping as this will ascertain what course I will be doing.

I didn't think that the courses would be seperate; I always thought Bookkeeping and Accounts went hand in hand.

I am going to go ahead with the C & G course, but I am dissapointed that it doesn't really count for much, I guess I was just naive!

Terri tell me about it, I think I just need something a bit more challenging and gets my brain used a bit more I think!

Thanks again, think if anything I will consider the AAT course but will have to start saving now!

Amy

Alison · Senior Member

HI Amy

Just thought if you were happy to work for an accountants or in a large accounts department of a commercial company for a while I know some companies or accountants offer a lower salary as such but pay for AAT study as part of the package.

It may be worth having a look on some job websites in your area or if you have chance to word out an applying on spec letter to send out to some accountants or large accounts departments.

Alison

Alison · Senior Member

Hi Terri

Are you still struggling to find clients?

I don't think it is as such your lack of experience or anything to do with yourself as a bookkeeper, you are in the North of England too? Think North of England has been quite heavily affected by the recession. I have lost 1 major client and 2 minor clients and have only been able to gain one new client which is 4 hours a fortnight which does not get me the hours I used to.

I used to have a client which was once a year to do his books ready for the accountants and not sure what is happening there so might have lost another client (this is another luxury service client) I had quite a few clients that were luxury services or goods based, when I took them on never expected a recession to happen).

Alison

amz27 · Veteran Member

Thanks for that Alison, thats something really interesting to know and something I will look into.

I think it would definately be worth it even if the pay wasn't that great; just to have the course paid for would be a bonus.

Will do a bit for research tonight! Thanks again

Terri · Senior Member

Yes Alison, I am still struggling to find clients. I am based in Sheffield. I'm advertising locally in shops, post offices and markets. I have an advert on Ebay, on the Sheffield Forum Business Directory and lots of free advertising websites. I've not had a single phone call since May. It is very disheartening, but like you say, I don't think that it is anything to do with me, I know of two bookkeepers through friends of friends and they are both experienced bookkeepers who have lost clients. Hopefully when things pick up in the economy, some work will come my way and in the meantime I am using my spare time wisely by studying, keeping my own books up to date, playing about on different bookkeeping systems, setting up templates for timesheets, invoices etc so I will be ready for the work when it comes. I hope work picks up for us all soon but I still have my one client :D

Terri

steve12 · Veteran Member

Hi Amz27,

Have just read your posting and my view is to follow the City & Guilds course through to level 3. City & Guilds qualifications in Bookkeeping and Accounts are highly respected and recognised in the bookkeeping profession and are some of the best qualifications you can have. Employers like them and if you are thinking of self employed work the C&G qualifications will cover all the theory similar to other bookkeeping qualifications. Also, as far as I am aware if you obtain C&G level 3 this can count towards part exemption to continue study towards accountancy qualifications. In addition C&G are usually much less expensive than for example ICB yet C&G is in my opinion as good if not a better qualification.

Good luck,

Steve.

amz27 · Veteran Member

Hi Steve, thank you for your reply.

Thats good to hear about the C & G qualificatons, as I am definately planning to do level 1 & 2, and hopefully even level 3 (although they do not do this at my local centre).

I have being doing alot of research, and I think after these I will hopefully be able to do an AAT NVQ and get government funding for it.

I am currently working as a receptionist, but there has been talks of the accounts lady leaving, so I would be taking her position; thus being able to do an NVQ.

But for the time being its good to know that these City & Guilds courses are recognised, as I am putting alot of my spare time and effort into them.

Thanks again,

Amy