I'm finding it harder of late to convince potential new clients that the services a professional bookkeeper provides is worth it. In this new age of 'austeritiy', were the smaller business is just keeping its head above water, they seem to need a lot more convincing that a bookkeeper will help their business. I go down the ususal route of saying it will mean they have more time to concentrate on what they do best, without the worry of the accounts preparation 'legwork'etc. That it could save them money at the year end with their accountant etc, but often of late, I have noticed that more and more businesses are looking on us as an unecessary luxury, that they cannot afford to continue. Just wonders what others thought / were experiencing?
From the accountants perspective, we are also finding clients looking at DIY. The trick is to add value, and take the focus away from the cost. However, this is easier said than done!
Client has less work, therefore more time so wants to DIY it. Really if they are having a downturn in business they should be concentrating on marketing, not administration. Time should be better spent.
Perhaps look at a compromise? Streamline what you offer the client. Get the client to use a better system, such as one of the online ones. They do the sales and CRM side of it, you do the data input for purchases, bank rec etc. and production of management accounts.
It is important to think as a bookkeeper that you can do more. Become a trusted adviser or administrator. Help them with other aspects of their business. Even if it just pointing them in the right direction.
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Phil Hendy, The Accountancy Mentor
Are you thinking of setting up your own practice or have you set up and need some help?
If so a mentor may be the way forward - feel free to get in touch and see how I can assist you.
Are you also finding that the use of on line systems such as Kash Flow, Free Agent, Clear Books means that some clients can do the bookkeeping themselves?
Elaine, there's not much difference in principle between using software such as Sage/QB/etc and the online ones. Either you stick at it and pick it up, or you let someone else do it. We have a client who uses Kashflow, think's its brilliant because he's field based (IT repairs) and can raise invoices whilst at people's homes or workplace, but he still wants us to do the purchase invoice and bank processing.
I agree with you that it should make it easier, but the ease probably comes with not being tied to one machine, automatic updates, etc.. rather than the ability or desire to do bookkeeping.
I think that some of the online (and offline) systems are making it easier for clients to do their own bookkeeping; however, it can be a bit of a false economy. Often there are lots of errors and additional accounting fees end up accruing, which are generally more expensive than a bookkeepers.
It depends also on the client. Some are much more capable than others of understanding the concepts and time involved. I can usually tell those that need a bookkeeper and those that won't be prepared to take on the cost of one!
My personal choice for most clients is that they deal with the invoicing and sales side of it and employ a bookkeeper to do the rest.
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Phil Hendy, The Accountancy Mentor
Are you thinking of setting up your own practice or have you set up and need some help?
If so a mentor may be the way forward - feel free to get in touch and see how I can assist you.
I had two clients in recent months who came to me for self assessment having done their own bookkeeping. Both times I had no option but to start from scratch, as to try and sort out the figures they had put in would have taken longer than redoing it. I think clients should stick to what they're best at really!
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Jenny
Responses are my opinion based on the information provided. All information should be thoroughly checked before being relied on.
Yes, it's cheap and they are told it's easy. And it is easy, shiny picture of a pound sign or whatever to get into the bank. The problem is that they are merrily putting figures into it with absolutely no idea of what they are trying to end up with, so everything is in the wrong place, the bank isn't rec'd, assuming they've even used separate accounts for the cash and bank transactions, asset purchases could be anywhere, things missing all over the shop, sales and purchase ledgers/payments not matched up. None of it their fault because they don't know what they're aiming for because they're not bookkeepers. If you have your client under control and he's doing the sales ledger (the only bit most clients are interested in) and you're doing the rest I'm sure it works fine.
That said, I do have one client who uses Quickbooks and does it all himself including the bank rec, at the end of the year I might have to make a couple of adjustments to some of the nominal expense postings but other than that it's perfect. End of year journals, print out acc's and I'm done and onto the tax return. He's in the minority!!
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Jenny
Responses are my opinion based on the information provided. All information should be thoroughly checked before being relied on.
So is the issue then one of clients think they can do bookkeeping because of cheap on line solutions when in fact maybe they can't?
How is the client convinced that they have got it so wrong?
The software supplier(s) say that the systems are so easy to use - don't they!!!
Definitely an issue Elaine. I now insist that I do setup of KashFlow for my clients that use it, including a training session. All FOC as it saves any future errors.
I think the problem is the systems do make it easier but it is still new to them.
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Phil Hendy, The Accountancy Mentor
Are you thinking of setting up your own practice or have you set up and need some help?
If so a mentor may be the way forward - feel free to get in touch and see how I can assist you.
I think the problem is the systems do make it easier but it is still new to them.
I think the problem is actually, the systems encourage people into "thinking" they understand bookkeeping when the reality is many only understand the software.
I'm not having a go at anybody and I hope this doesn't come across as offensive to anyone - But look at many of the "support" questions posted on this forum e.g. How do i do this in Sage, when it's pretty clear the underlying issue is the bookkeeping logic underpinning their particular problem.
Imho.
-- Edited by ADAS on Tuesday 8th of February 2011 01:46:14 PM
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Tony
Responses are intended as outline only. Formal advice should be sort from your Institutes Technical Department or a suitably qualified Accountant.
I think the problem is the systems do make it easier but it is still new to them.
I think the problem is actually, the systems encourage people into "thinking" they understand bookkeeping when the reality is many only understand the software.
I'm not having a go at anybody and I hope this doesn't come across as offensive to anyone - But look at many of the "support" questions posted on this forum e.g. How do i do this in Sage, when it's pretty clear the underlying issue is the bookkeeping logic underpinning their particular problem.
Imho.
-- Edited by ADAS on Tuesday 8th of February 2011 01:46:14 PM
Couldn't agree more. What is more worrying is if the question is from somone who is a self-employed book-keeper rather than a business person trying to do their own books.
I'm not having a go at anybody and I hope this doesn't come across as offensive to anyone - But look at many of the "support" questions posted on this forum e.g. How do i do this in Sage, when it's pretty clear the underlying issue is the bookkeeping logic underpinning their particular problem.
Imho.
-- Edited by ADAS on Tuesday 8th of February 2011 01:46:14 PM
Couldn't agree more. What is more worrying is if the question is from somone who is a self-employed book-keeper rather than a business person trying to do their own books.
I completely agree with this. I too am not having a go at anyone who posts here. At least those people realise they need clarification on a particular issue, and are trying to get some advice first. My concern is when someone puts up a question and it is obvious that they lack a basic understanding of accounts. - You can often see that by them needing further clarification after someone has answered the query. The thing that frightens me is the number of people who seem to think they can 'learn' on the job, whilst doing someone elses accounts - if you make a mistake and its picked up by HMRC, it may cost you dearly.....
Bear in mind the new penalty regime and the fact that HMRC seem to be 'coming after' the advisers now! I think we all have to make sure that we take on work within our capabilities - whilst we may not know the answers to everything, we should know when to ask and where to go to get the help / support that we need including e.g. tax help lines, a personal network of trusted colleagues, our professional bodies etc
Bear in mind the new penalty regime and the fact that HMRC seem to be 'coming after' the advisers now! I think we all have to make sure that we take on work within our capabilities - whilst we may not know the answers to everything, we should know when to ask and where to go to get the help / support that we need including e.g. tax help lines, a personal network of trusted colleagues, our professional bodies etc
Sorry, thats what I meant. Yes the client will have to pay for errors and fines relating to the mistakes in their accounts, but whose to say they won't take the view that the 'professional' they have paid to do it has messed up, and the will want his pound of flesh from us! Liz
Liz - I totally agree. Should have put ... 'coming after' the advisers now as well! The clients should have the right to expect us to provide a good services and a right of recourse if we get it wrong. I think in the rule books for most professional bodies is something along the lines of only doing work within our capabilities. The desire for fees should never override this IMO.
The clients should have the right to expect us to provide a good services and a right of recourse if we get it wrong. I think in the rule books for most professional bodies is something along the lines of only doing work within our capabilities.
The desire for fees should never override this IMO.
Possibly one of the hardest but the most important things to learn, in my experience anyway.
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Tony
Responses are intended as outline only. Formal advice should be sort from your Institutes Technical Department or a suitably qualified Accountant.
