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Post Info TOPIC: Billing / managing time


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Billing / managing time
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What is the best way of billing time?  Are there programmes that do this for you or is a simple Excel sheet enough?



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I recently got a trial copy of "four four time" software (http://www.fourfourtime.co.uk/) - my 2 week trial is about to expire and I am going to buy it.

I have found it really very easy to use. It has a start and stop botton, so it is very quick and easy to remember to use. Seconds to log against a client, click on start and add a note of detail. Then click on stop when I have finished. Very useful if you get interuptions - which has always been my problem when trying to keep track of what I am doing, and time spent.  I provides detailed reports with time spent to the second. It keeps a running total against a particular "project/client" until you have finished. I keep a copy of the report with the invoice and then archive the "project/client" and then add a new one to start a running total in preperation of the next invoice.

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Frauke
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I've looked at loads of different time and billing software, many of them are so complex I'd spend more time logging my time than actually doing any work! Currently using an excel sheet which works quite well. From the brief demo this one looks a bit simpler so may download and have a better look at it.

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The way I do it is to avoid time logging and quote a fixed fee!

But if you need too, All I do is keep a note of time started and finished in my calendar on both Outlook and my iphone (yes I know!!) but it does work for me.

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I do do some fixed fee work, but even then I like to moniter how long it actually took me to do...(there's an analyst in me screaming to get out lol)

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Thanks everyone, all useful advice (as always) :)

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Merlion ABS wrote:

All I do is keep a note of time started and finished in my calendar on both Outlook and my iphone (yes I know!!) but it does work for me.




 I do the same but with an Android phone - does that make me as bad biggrin


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Tony

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Lol, I would like to think so, but unfortunately not!!

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I used to use outlook, but struggled to keep on top of it because of interruptions.

So for years I just worked on "guess work and fixed fees"!

The Four Four Time software is a doodle to use - and now I can more accurately bill, and on the rare occassions anyone questions what I actually do, I can in produce a report in seconds with the details for me to tell them. I have had a few things I have undercharged for, and no longer fee guilty for increasing the charge - and the few things I have over charged, I have happy clients who have their fees reduced.

I have only had it a short time, but it makes me more confident in quoting as I now know for sure how much time things take me (including telephone calls to HMRC!).

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Frauke
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Thanks everyone :)

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Hi Frauke.

Can you record the work you do in the software you use?



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Tony

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Hello,

I have just started using an app on my iphone called Time Sheet, I have to say so far I have found it really useful as i like to analyse my hours v income etc...anyway here's the link:

http://www.augustinesoftware.com/timeSheetLite.html

The lite version is free to download - well worth a try - oh and you can email a CSV or TSV file showing details of you hours worked which I think is great.

Hope this is handy for some of you.

Ann-marie

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ADAS wrote:

Hi Frauke. Can you record the work you do in the software you use?


 

 Yes I can - using "add a note" against the client/project title.

 



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Frauke
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The fourfourtime sounds great - I've always thought how I would bill a client if I actually did go self employed (still don't feel confident enough but I'll get there!). The only thing I can't get my head around, but I haven't yet tried out the fourfourtime so I have no idea how it really works.......how does a client know if you're logging in and not doing any work? What is it actually recording? Is it just time that you have been logged in? Or the work you are doing aswell? Or is it just your notes that say what work you have done?




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gbm


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Just out of interest, do people record their time for profitability analysis or is this the basis on which they bill clients?

If it is, then if you spend too much time, the client will go elsewhere - in which case you have a cap - which effectively renders your relationship as fixed fee and makes timesheets rather redundant?



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Noona, in our line of work being honest is paramount! Personally I always felt guilty if I charged a client for work I did not do. Years ago, a worked for a large tax practice and had to log all of my time against a client - no matter what I did. It was awful trying to allocate time I spent going to the loo - I ended up leaving as I found that aspect of the job too stressful.


FourFourTime is free for the first 14 days. It works on a simple basis - choose a project/client name - click start when you start and click stop when you stop! Quick and easy if you get interrupted! The system adds the time done against the project/client name so you can see it accumulated as you go along. It does the time to the second. When you click start you can add a note - about what you are doing. You can get lots of different reports including reports for any period against a project/client. So if you bill someone for x hours, and they ask what you were actually doing, you can refer back to the notes you added at the time and tell them. I often do lots of things which may only take a short time for clients - but when asked cannot list them. Now its easy to take a look and have it in front of me if I'm put on the spot!

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Frauke
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yeah, but does that make me as bad biggrin?




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Has anyone found a use friendly freebie for time-tracking software? I will go with a web-based one if no option but I'm generally not a fan of cloud solutions. I have used the same as Frauke in the past and liked it very much but aim to cut down hours and thus my outgoings. I would use the record to justify a future increase whether there has been fixed fees or similar time billed in the past.

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Yeah, Amphis software who make the great CRM package I use make a time tracker which is free called Amphis Time. You can download it here: http://www.amphis-software.com/time.htm

Kris

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Thanks Kris.

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YLB-HO wrote:

I used to use outlook, but struggled to keep on top of it because of interruptions. So for years I just worked on "guess work and fixed fees"! The Four Four Time software is a doodle to use - and now I can more accurately bill, and on the rare occassions anyone questions what I actually do, I can in produce a report in seconds with the details for me to tell them. I have had a few things I have undercharged for, and no longer fee guilty for increasing the charge - and the few things I have over charged, I have happy clients who have their fees reduced. I have only had it a short time, but it makes me more confident in quoting as I now know for sure how much time things take me (including telephone calls to HMRC!).


That sounds great! A professional, organised way of keeping tabs on things, and the ability to access a report v useful too. Thanks for posting this - I'm going to have a closer look and suggest the use of it with a few colleagues.....

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