Hi
I'm new on here, I've lurked for a while and just decided to join.
I've been in business just over a year and have a few clients, but I have some issues with 2 of them. The 1st 1 is he arranges to come round to drop stuff off, which in his words is urgent, then doesn't show or answer his phone. He eventually called a few hours later and just said it's ok I'll come this afternoon instead, eh no you wont! This has happened a few times now.
The other one I work at his premises but he quite often cancels the day before I'm due to go.
My question is, do you think I'm within my rights to charge them for my time? I think definitely on the 1st one, but not sure on the second.
Thanks :)
Unfortunately clients are a disorganised bunch sometimes. We used to have a standard charge of half an hour for missed appts and I used to rigorously enforce it. Didn't make them any better at turning up, but I felt slightly better about it! There is nothing more annoying than clearing your desk off ready for an appt and hanging around for 20 mins for a no show.
Re your second client, if someone phones me to rearrange, even if it's 15 mins before then I'm ok with that as it means I can carry on with what I'm doing, and if they don't get their work done then that's their tough luck for not bringing it in/being available.
You will probably have to take a hard line with the first guy to get him to understand that he's not the centre of your world and you have other things to do! You're quite entitled to charge for wasted time, but you'd have to let him know first.
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Jenny
Responses are my opinion based on the information provided. All information should be thoroughly checked before being relied on.
Thanks for your reply.
That's what I thought aswell, what really bugged me today was that he knew I had re arranged other things to see him, grrr, lol. I'm supposed to be seeing him tomorrow so I'm going to tell him that from now on he'll get charged when he doesn't show and doesn't phone in advance to let me know.
I think everyone has a client or two like this, ironically, they're usually the ones who need everything done in a rush !!
Yes that's the 1, not seem him for ages and when I get the stuff off him tomorrow he'll be asking what his vat liability is, then he'll stalk me for days til I can tell him lol.
Any idea where to find normal clients, I only find the oddballs!
Agree it is usually the one who wants something done urgently. I would be inclined not to deliver promptly if they don't provide information by a certain time, particularly if consistently doing it. A couple of HMRC penalties would sort them out!
The biggest problem is they would move elsewhere and blame the bookkeeper/ accountant - you can soon suss this type of client when having your initial meetings!
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Phil Hendy, The Accountancy Mentor
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Agree it is usually the one who wants something done urgently. I would be inclined not to deliver promptly if they don't provide information by a certain time, particularly if consistently doing it. A couple of HMRC penalties would sort them out!
The biggest problem is they would move elsewhere and blame the bookkeeper/ accountant - you can soon suss this type of client when having your initial meetings!
He's had loads of hmrc fines, not with me but with his previous bookkeeper (ex wife) so you'd think he would learn. And as I'm sure you've guessed I don't get paid quickly either, I ended up holding back work last time. Unfortunately I don't have enough clients yet to be able to pick and choose.
Oh the joys of being self employed!
The first guy doesn't need to know you don't have enough clients to pick and choose - be firm with him and if necessary, sack him.
Otherwise he'll demoralise you to the point where you'll struggle to get other clients anyway (and yes, that IS bitter experience talking!)
With the second guy, do you always just drop everything when he asks to rearrange? Try being "already booked out" for a couple of days, even if you haven't got anything else to do...
We all get them once in a while, especially when we first start out - don't worry though, there are great clients out there too!
On the general theme, it is counter intuitive to get rid of clients, but it can also be liberating. You find the world doesn't stop spinning, it frees you up to work on more appreciative clients, and you just feel happier.
No I don't drop everything for him, our arrangement is I go every Friday, when he cancels he assumes I can go on the Monday instead, but the last few times I've said I can't make it. Means I'm losing a weeks money, but I think he's learning!
He got the hmrc fines coz his ex wife said she was paying vat paye and self assessment but was keeping the money!
My latest clients are swingers who keep trying to recruit me, but that's a whole other story lol
I don't know a bookkeeper or accountant who doesn't have a client like this. I have one quy who thinks because I am quite flexible with my hours that he can ring me whenever it suits him, he caught me on the hop one night at 10.15pm when I had a bottle of wine in me.
There's always one who thinks if you pull them out of a hole once, they can make every matter urgent to get things done in a hurry.
You need to be thick skinned in this business, some people tend to leave books to the last then dump stuff on you, and will blame you if the returns are late. That's how people can be in this game unfortunately, annoying at times but you can't let it get to you.
Mmm, sounds like the same sort of client who has a total disregard for the lives of anyone beyond work. You know the sort, expects professional working days from their staff. i.e. pay for seven hours but expect people to work nine regardless as to whether you did the full days work in five!
Have you thought about charging a different rate if you are contacted outside normal working hours?
If you choose a rate that would make a client think twice then that would restrict things only to real emergencies.
My record was nine times normal rate with a minimum eight hours (that was for working on a Christmas day) but a more reasonable amount which would still be enough to make a client think twice would be three to four times normal rate for any call after 20:00 and Sundays and bank holidays (unless of course such is instigated by you or work done by you that could have been done at some other time). For that rate they're more likely to think. Ok, I can wait till the morning. And if they don't. Well, at least you've been well compensated for your time.
Also, you would need to get that written into your terms and conditions from either the outset of the arrangement or as an emphasised addendum.
All the best,
Shaun.
P.S. love the name that you've chosen. Mushroom. i.e. something kept in the dark and fed on bulls**t!
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
I normally wouldn't answer my phone at that time, but with being a bit intoxicated I lifted the phone without looking at the caller id. I do need to get terms and conditions drawn up, I am far too lax with that. I didn't bother so far as my business started part time with one client when I was working full time, then just expanded through word of mouth to the point where I had enough to jack in my main job, but I know now I need to pull my socks up and get this sorted. Do you have any by any chance that you could email? It would save me tbe bother of reinventing the wheel.
As for the name, I feel like a mushroom in this job at times, think some of my clients assume that I have psychic mindreading abilities and don't have to let me know half the stuff they should.
on the contract front though I'm really sorry but I don't want to spread mine around as it's one cobbled together from agency contracts and is quite specificly angled towards banking work.
Also, whilst I'm sure that you're not the sort to sue when a clients legal department manages to drive a truck through a loophole in it, it really isn't the sort of thing that I'm happy to distribute. Really sorry on that one.
For sample AAT engagement letters have a look here :
At least the above are good starting points to build the engagement letter that is right for your business.
good luck,
Shaun.
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
No problem Shaun, I used to work in HR so am well aware that a lot of the time these contracts and agreements aren't worth the paper they're on, but I do need something in place. This will give me a starting point.
