Back to the question in point, from a Tyke, the first accounting software I used was Sage (had previously used spreadsheets) and I became "expert" in it and taught it for several years, however, I would not now particularly recommend it for several reasons - cost - inflexibility, particularly on cash accounting - aggressive marketing. I think for a new business using a qualified book-keeper QB is actually quite good, subject to everything Amanda says about single rather than multiple users. The reporting, to my mind is second to none, incredibly flexible and really easy to customise and memorise as are the invoices and in fact any transaction. Its VAT is a bit wobbly although this seems to have been addressed in the latest version. It is certainly far cheaper than Sage - I recently bought 2010 pro for under £200 which is for 99 user. The only thing I don't like is that only journals show debit and credit - supplier and customer accounts show as just a list of amounts with either nothing or a minus sign against them, if I'm reconciling I export to Excel and put them in debt and credit, but that's probably just me and my mind. I've looked at VT and it seems fine particularly the price but I'm not sure on the reporting. I suppose it depends a lot on the clients because for most a standard Trading, P&L and Balance sheet would be OK but if one works with charities or other companies who want their income/expenditure broken down to projects I find QB is the best for this type of reporting.
-- Edited by semsley on Sunday 8th of January 2012 10:45:25 PM
Taking this off thread totally, back to the Dallas avatars, Shaun did you see Lucy Ewing (Charlene Tilton) on Dancing on ice tonight??
Remember my Avatar?.........
-- Edited by Amanda on Sunday 8th of January 2012 10:20:03 PM
Hi Amanda
I love dancing on ice (being a skater in my younger days) Charlene (the poison dwarf as she was called) I thought did very well and your avatar was great - NB I've kept my Miss Ellie. I did think the wrong person went tonight whilst the girl they kept (Heidi something) did nice moves in the air she didn't skate at all on her own whereas Andy did and although he didn't perhaps look as pretty he did demonstate skating ability.
I like the reporting on it Sheila I must say, I don't use Sage instants enough and I find the reporting not as easy as QB. I am looking at uprading as like you say the later versions are even better than the one I have.
The one bad thing I will say is the support side of it is rubbish as its a call centre and not bookkeepers! I don't have support anymore as I have taught myself more than them!
Ok, in light of Luthor making comments about Sage being cheaper than other software but being unable to substantiate these claims. I thought I would outline some costs.
Sage 50 is £580 plus VAT for a single company version.
VT Transaction+ (unlimited companies) is £125 + VAT
Quickbooks Pro (multi company to 99 companies) is £269 + VAT but you can pay this monthly for £21 + VAT per month
As you can see, not only is Sage not the cheapest, it's the most expensive of the 3 mentioned so far.
All details have been taken from the respective company websites.
Kris
I've been quoted the following so far for Sage 50 with 1-5 companies: £695.00 + VAT = £834.00.
-- Edited by 123_Lesley on Monday 9th of January 2012 10:13:07 AM
Ok, in light of Luthor making comments about Sage being cheaper than other software but being unable to substantiate these claims. I thought I would outline some costs.
Sage 50 is £580 plus VAT for a single company version.
VT Transaction+ (unlimited companies) is £125 + VAT
Quickbooks Pro (multi company to 99 companies) is £269 + VAT but you can pay this monthly for £21 + VAT per month
As you can see, not only is Sage not the cheapest, it's the most expensive of the 3 mentioned so far.
All details have been taken from the respective company websites.
Kris
I've been quoted the following so far for Sage 50 with 1-5 companies: £695.00 + VAT = £ 834.00!!!
If you say that one of the companies is yourself, leaving you with 4 to 'sell' then you would need to charge each client an extra £18 per month just to cover software costs.
I suppose you need to ask yourself if you think it's worth that. I know my answer.
The ICB were in discussions with Sage over the pricing for its members and we were waiting on good news being announced. I wonder if this good news has been announced and I've missed it.
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There are also alternatives not yet mentioned, probably because Dalbir doesnt seem to have been on. Online or cloud based systems are used by many. These include:
Arithmo Sage One Kashflow Accounts Portal Liquid Accounts Freeagent
The ICB were in discussions with Sage over the pricing for its members and we were waiting on good news being announced. I wonder if this good news has been announced and I've missed it.
The last I heard they were still waiting. The good news will be a tenner off or something ridiculous.
I've just been reading through all the remaining posts and I hadn't realised that there had been a ''disagreement''. I've been reading through the posts in order and wanted to reply to the cost question about Sage.
Hmm, It seems that you have to be very careful about what you say and how you say it?!
I understand what you're saying about Sage... in equating the costs per company... I'm going to take a look at the post that Shamus reccomended... ''Convince me I dodn't need Sage''...
The ICB were in discussions with Sage over the pricing for its members and we were waiting on good news being announced. I wonder if this good news has been announced and I've missed it.
The last I heard they were still waiting. The good news will be a tenner off or something ridiculous.
Kris
They really do need to fight our corner here... but then doesn't the ICB also have its own software to promote now?
I think they resell a white label cloud product from IRIS. For a cloud solution I don't think it's a bad price, if I remember right it was about £3 per client/month but you need to buy a minimum of 10 clients and pay annually.
We must have crossed last night. I thought Charlene did well on dancing on ice. I think the wrong one went too, he looked gutted.
Dallas is coming back so keep the avatar Sheila!
@ Lesley - QB is definately worth a look, the cost is good, one thing I will say don't have the payroll its expensive and not worth it. For payroll I use 12pay, far cheaper and really good. QB is alot less then SAGE and I would say when you are just starting out will save you alot of money, which can then be spent on advertising instead.
Sorry for the delayed reply, just reading through the posts that I've missed since my last foray onto the site (Can I take my helmet and gas mask off now?).
On the Dancing on Ice front, afraid not. Anything to do with dancing or singing or talent shows is really not my cup of tea even if Charlene's on it... Then again, maybe I just want to remember her as she was rather than at the age she is now.
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
I'm just at the point where I'm going to invest in a software package and I was going to go for Sage 50 (Multi-company). I did all of my ICB exams on Sage, but then someone recommended VT Transaction plus, and it's a lot cheaper... £600 chesper!
I'm a bookkeeper looking to do work mainly for sole traders and the occasional small business.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you.
I would definitely recommend VT+
I started off using sage and had no complaints. I've dabbled with quickbooks but don't really like it. Started using VT+ properly about 6 months ago and it is brilliant, especially on data entry.
It is also easy to correct a mistake, unlike sage. Simply right click on the transaction and edit, even with a bank transfer (which you can't do on sage) Fair point that it hasn't got the reporting capabilities that sage has but I find I can still get that info should I need to.
The only drawback for company use is there is no audit trail, which would make it to easy for an unscrupulous employee to fiddle (imo)
Thank you for your valued comments about VT+ and cost wise it really does seem like a ''no-brainer''.
I will proceed to try it on their 60 day free trial... btw... do you get an instruction guide with it at all... or can you pretty much apply Sage technique to it?
there is a user manual but it's not really an ABC type instruction book.
My approach was to keep doing a set of accounts on VT until I got the results that I was expecting. I learnt a lot that way and would thougherly recomend it.
When you go for the free trial get VT Accounts which comes with VT Transaction+. It really helps you to understand what goes where when you see a proper set of acccounts beingproduced.
When you sign up properly you can choose to go with VT Accounts which is the full package or just choose to take the VT Transaction+ part of it. The main thing is that during the important learning stage you will have been able to push things all the way through so you understand what will eventually end up where.
kind regards,
Shaun.
P.S. edited due to terrible English!
-- Edited by Shamus on Monday 16th of January 2012 09:25:34 PM
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
