How to gain new clients - The Book-keepers Forum (UK)

Sage77 · Member

How to gain new clients

Elaine R · Senior Member

Hi,

I a still trying to find my first client. I work in Industry as an Assistant Management Accountant but decided I would like to do some bookkeeping work from home.
I've had business cards and leaflets printed and have handed a few out. I've had one or two show interest but not actually gained any clients just yet.
I'm finding it frustrating but will plod on until I get some clients. I have a confidence issue as well. I've been used to having someone there to guide me for the last 10 years or so, so now going it alone seems a bit daunting. I'm not a quitter though so will carry on. I've been looking on the internet for small companies in my local are and have started to email them asking them if they need any bookkeeping doing. I have an appointment next week with an Accountant with the view to do bit of outsourced work. I'm also going to get my cards and leaflets and do a walk around in my local area, calling in on small businesses.

Elaine

MarkS · Expert

Different ways are

1. Speak to local accountants and see if they need bookkeeping outsourced (probably look for sole practitioners as opposed to ones with staff as they will tend to keep the bookkeeping inhouse

2. Flyers - go and hand then out in shops/hairdressers/industrial estates. Anywhere where business people might be. Good one might be to leave a bundle at burger vans where tradesman who are normally self employed will frequent.

3. Cards in newsagents windows

4. Free listings eg yell, thomson local, etc

5. Advert in local circulated magazine (though this will cost)

6. Gumtree

7. Networking groups - try and find free ones

They are just a few of the common ones of the top of my head.

Regards

MarkS

Shamus · Forum Moderator & Expert

BobHarper wrote:
We have come to the conclusion that bookkeeping is not the place to be. It is low value and technology is reducing the amout of work.

lol Bob,

Thats it come onto a bookkeepers forum and tell people that they're all doomed.

Can I assume that Crunchers are going into retailing gas ovens and razor blades.

I would have voiced it a lot more diplomatically but there is actually a lot of truth in your words and it's also my own belief that clients expect bookkeepers to be cheaper accountants rather than offering the traditional bookkeeping only services (something learnt by trying to work within the remit of ACCA regulation 8).

It has to be said that for as long as statutory filing is required the full spectrum of services will be required... Clients just don't want to go to different providers for the two parts of that equation.

We have different opinions as to the benefits of various bits of technology but there is no doubt that such has been making our lives easier for decades and will continue to improve throughput and efficiency.

The real issue is, how does this fit in with the reality that this is often a profession based around single parents working from a kitchen table around their childrens school hours.

Sometimes when people talk about technology and advancement the real issue is not whether it could perform a task but whether it should.

The other downside to your arguement of course is that software is no replacement for knowledge and if we are all to be accountants then we need to be real accountants able to give clients advice based on a serious knowledge base which only comes with many years of study and associated experience.

People cannot just give up being bookkeepers to become accountants. That seems the equivalent of giving up being a GP to become a surgeon. There is commonality in the professions but there is no easy transition from one to the other.

And back to you.

... Why am I now thinking that the collective readership of the site is holding it's breath....

kind regards,

Shaun.

p.s. edited because I had moved a paragraph up the reply but it still referenced the originally preceeding paragraph which made the reply a little confusing.

-- Edited by Shamus on Friday 19th of October 2012 01:13:16 PM

Don Tax · Expert

Hi Sage,

Word of mouth has a couple of advantages

a) A contented client will sing your praises, and

b) give the potential client the low-down of what is expected of them.

c) There's also a fair chance a new client will be in a sector familiar to you. For instance, I can quickly rattle out unincorporated individuals, shops and traders.

d) From the client point of view, the most important thing is trust and this is one reason why the contact to conversion rate is higher by word of mouth.

The question might be, how best to increase those type of recommendations? My tip, therefore is to make yourself known in every club and association you possibly can; both online and in the local community. Sports and social, political, church, school, hospital you name it. I just wish I'd discovered this forum earlier as I'd been approached by ltd clients and and ended up a rabbit caught in the headlights. My other half is a complete natural at this sort of networking, maybe due to originally coming from a smallish village. I also do voluntary tax work, but that's more of a passion and somewhat an education.

Any hobbies you have might be a pointer to the sort of association you would first gravitate towards.

Hope that helps and welcome to the forum.

Tim

kjmcculloch83 · Expert

No Shaun, 20 x £75000 = £1.5m less 20 x £25000 = £1m

I think Bob is talking about the difference between the two.

You should have stuck with ICB

-- Edited by kjmcculloch83 on Friday 19th of October 2012 06:07:05 PM

BobHarper · Guru

Louise - you say you are ready to build your business so I have a couple of questions:

Does that mean you plan to employ people or just want more work for yourself?

What are your profit expectations?

We have come to the conclusion that bookkeeping is not the place to be. It is low value and technology is reducing the about of work. We have decide to add on accounting services so we do not need to work with accountants and then roll-in management accounting/business advisory service.

I'd encourage you to look at the new technology and go and talk to some accountants and see how you get on.

Amanda · Expert

I've net worked with Accountants and it definitely pays off, it may take a why but worth a go, just get yourself know to everyone, if you have kids offer to be the treasurer of the PTA, no one ever wants that job!

Advertise like made without spending a fortune, website is a good one.

I got a client from the local chip shop and my card has cost nothing to put up there so you just never know!

Good luck

Elaine R · Senior Member

Hi Mark,

Your comment about targeting sole practitioner accountants. I have a meeting with one next Thursday to see about taking on some contract work. Are you saying they are more likely to let you work remotely rather than on site? Have you experienced this? I can only work remotely as I like yourself work full time so can only offer my services in the evenings and weekends.

Elaine

BobHarper · Guru

@Shaun - my argument is based on knowledge and I didn't say the transition to accountant was easy. But, it is not that hard and much easier within a network of people who will support you.

Shamus · Forum Moderator & Expert

BobHarper wrote:
@Shaun - my argument is based on knowledge and I didn't say the transition to accountant was easy. But, it is not that hard and much easier within a network of people who will support you.

Such as the ACCA or CIMA or the ICAEW or ICAS?

Just messing with you. I know what you meant. wink

Shamus · Forum Moderator & Expert

Shamus wrote:
BobHarper wrote:
@Shaun - my argument is based on knowledge and I didn't say the transition to accountant was easy. But, it is not that hard and much easier within a network of people who will support you.
Such as the ACCA or CIMA or the ICAEW or ICAS?
Just messing with you. I know what you meant.

But more seriously, do the ACCA papers and tell me that it isn't hard!

Spamkebab · Expert

I was also wondering if you were talking about being a qualified Accountant Bob.

Would you class an AAT qualified to be an Accountant or a Bookkeeper Bob?

Neil.

Elaine R · Senior Member

Hi Shaun/Bob,

I'm sitting CIMA and not finding that too easy. Especially whilst working full time.

Elaine

BobHarper · Guru

@Neil - my market and comments are about small businesses and this maybe too simplistic but for me (and I suspect many business owners) bookkeeping stops with the VAT return.

The next stage is producing a set of accounts (which is management accounting) and then there is year-end accounts/tax which is what an accountant does.

So, I think AAT is great but I think most newly qualified people with no/minimal accounting experience will probably need some support and extra training.

@Elaine - why do you hope to do with CIMA?

Shamus · Forum Moderator & Expert

And that Neil is the million dollar question!

The higher bodies regard AAT as a bookkeeping qualification and a good start.

The bookkeeping bodies regard it as an accountancy qualification.

My view is that it's neither and both (so all bases covered there).

You've peeked over the fence and seen the monstrous leviathan that lies in wait there after AAT so I think understand well what I mean.

I actually think that the AAT really identify themselves better than anyone else classifies them. They are accounting technicians. They come to the table with a great knowledge of the mechanics of double entry and enough knowledge of the basics of accountancy to make competent, skilled individuals.

I do not feel that they should be called accountants on the basis of the qualification alone as the training is too restrictive to offer well rounded advice considering all options to clients.

I do however feel that AAT people deserve respect for gaining a sound qualification that is a stepping stone into accountancy if not to my mind an end in itself.

Shaun.

p.s. if anyone thinks that was an anti AAT post please re-read it as that is not how it is intended to read.

Shamus · Forum Moderator & Expert

BobHarper wrote:
@Neil - my market and comments are about small businesses and this maybe too simplistic but for me (and I suspect many business owners) bookkeeping stops with the VAT return.

The next stage is producing a set of accounts (which is management accounting) and then there is year-end accounts/tax which is what an accountant does.

So, I think AAT is great but I think most newly qualified people with no/minimal accounting experience will probably need some support and extra training.

Your expectation of where bookkeeping stops complies with the ACCA definition which basically states that the role incorporates bookkeeping to trail balance, VAT and Payroll work.

Both management and financial accounting are the role of an accountant from any of the accountancy bodies. All serious qualifications have about a 40/40 split between those with the remainder being Law, human resources, management theory and psychology, etc.

Agreed on the last point as there is a quantum leap between theory and practice which is why all of the accountancy bodies expect one to gain practical experience under a suitably qualified accountant before allowing membership let alone a practice licence.

Shaun.

Spamkebab · Expert

That was well Anti, that was Antier than anything ever said about Kindle or Sage, that was Antier than my sex swap uncle.

I agree with your comment about training/experience Bob. I wish you could buy experience from training providers like you can the study kits.

Neil.

BobHarper · Guru

@Neil - how much do you think the experience is worth?

My take is 20 years working at £75,000 profit rather than £25,000 i.e. £1m.

The experience needed covers operational and practice development. But, our experience is that most sole-traders can't do what needs to be done in terms of practice development even if they have the operational knowledge. That's why we've set up a branded network/franchise.

Shamus · Forum Moderator & Expert

BobHarper wrote:
My take is 20 years working at £75,000 profit rather than £25,000 i.e. £1m.

that's £1.5m

see the difference that you get there with ACCA and CIMA people wink

Shamus · Forum Moderator & Expert

Ah, I see the problem Kris.

Coming from the ACCA we only work with the figures on the paper rather than making assumptions. wink

Also of course we wouldn't dream about offsetting figures such as these but rather presenting them seperately. biggrin

kjmcculloch83 · Expert

Indeed... but the proposition must be attractive, join crunchers and earn £1m in 20 years.

MarkS · Expert

Hi Elaine

Comment about sole practitioner is that they are more likely to sub contract bookkeeping work as opposed to accountant who has employees as there isnt much money in bookkeeping for a sole practitioner accountant so they are more likely to pass the work onto someone else and concentrate on the more lucrative year end accounts work and tax advice. An accountant who has staff is more likely to keep the bookkeeping in house as they can charge the client say £25-£30 per hour for the bookkeeping work but pay their staff say £10-£15 to do the work. They also have to have work for their staff to do so unless they are really run off their feet they will keep it inhouse.

Cant comment from experience.

I work full time with a CA firm in Edinburgh but have over 30 clients of my own (split roughly 50/50 between ltd and sole traders) that I do the full works for including; some bookkeeping, management accounts, year end accounts, tax returns, VAT and payroll. I dont do any subcontracted work for an accountant. I am slightly different from most forum members in that I offer accounting services as opposed to pure bookkeeping.

Regards

MarkS

kjmcculloch83 · Expert

MarkS wrote:
I am slightly different from most forum members in that I offer accounting services as opposed to pure bookkeeping.

I thought most on the forum were similar in this.

Kris

Amanda · Expert

Mark, would you say that most of your work is accountancy/tax work as opposed to bookkeeping? And I know you work Full-time as well, how do you fit in all of it with young kids as well? Are you are very organised person? Are you clients straight forward with their tax returns or do you have any that are real problem clients with complicated tax stuff?

I am finding that as my kids are getting older I have less time to study as in the evenings I am a taxi to them, or we get in late because they have after school activities, so then dinner is later, then they go to bed later as they have homework/reading to do or they need picking up at say 9.30-10pm from another activity, so sitting down and actually studying or doing any extra work is a real problem.

@ Elaine, I think Mark is right in try to target the small accountants that work on their own as they probably won't want the bookkeeping or the payroll as its not cost effective for them. I am just getting stuff through from one now and hoping to build on it.

Shamus · Forum Moderator & Expert

kjmcculloch83 wrote:
MarkS wrote:
I am slightly different from most forum members in that I offer accounting services as opposed to pure bookkeeping.
I thought most on the forum were similar in this.
Kris

I stand to be corrected but like Kris I'm pretty sure the bulk of the regulars offer accounting services

I can't comment about those reading in the background but of the contributors I think that the major share are accountants, working towards becoming accountants or bookkeepers offering accounting services.

Shaun.

kjmcculloch83 · Expert

yeah, thats what I thought Shaun.

Kris

MarkS · Expert

Shaun/Kris - thought most people on here leaned more to bookkeeping services as opposed to accounting services though happen to be corrected.

Amanda - most of my clients are mainly just year end accounts/tax returns though of the new clients that i have taken on in the last month most of them have taken up the service of me maintaining accounting records and providing quarterly management. Yeah it tough filling it all in the at moment and working crazy hours. At the moment I have enough of my own work to take up about 2 days work a week. Looking at a few options but will probably be going part time with my own work and part time with a job in the next few months with the view to building up my own business over the next year. I would expect with time to market/network properly I will have 100 clients by this time next year so can go full time for myself. (well thats the plan anyway). Most of my clients tax affairs are fairly straight forward with either sole trader/salary/dividend income from ltd company and mixture of bank interest, dividends, pension contributions and chartible contributions. So fairly bog standard tax returns. Then there is the added complication of meeting clients as can only meet them in evenings or weekends but this tends to suit my clients so they can do their job during the day. Had 2 evening meetings this week, got 3 the week coming as well as a SAGE training session with a potential client next Sunday.

Regards

MarkS