Hi - I'm new to this forum and am just looking for some advice about accountancy qualifications. I have passed ACCA F4-F7 (and the Prof Ethics module and CPD years) but am really not liking the push towards tax or audit that seems to come with the higher qualifications with ACCA. I have looked at IFA Level 5 Financial Manager (SME Diploma) and liked the syllabus. I am about to set up my own bookkeeping business and think this would be a better qualification for me as I want to concentrate on smaller Ltd CO accounts. Will IFA Level 5 give me a professional accountancy qualification? As time progresses I would like to make my bookkeeping company my main source of income (and be my own boss!!) but don't particularly want to be a Chartered Accountant. I've always been told that its basically ACCA or nothing but wonder if there's another way? My current job have specified in my letter of appointment that I 'gain a professional accountancy qualification' but haven't told me which one or how long I have to complete it (which I didn't like very much)
Are there others out there that have IFA Level 5 qualification and have made a success of it and if so, please let me know.....
Shaun the forum moderator will be the best person to advise you on this as he ACCA part qualified and a member of the IFA in practice. I'm sure he will be along before too long.
IFA would be a good choice for self employment although a higher level qualification than necessary for bookkeeping. If it is purely bookkeeping you want to do then International Association of Bookkeepers or Institute of Certified Bookkeepers could be alternative choices.
Would I be right in thinking that maybe you've hit a brick wall with F8?
Don't despair with that one, it's all in day after day after day of old question papers under exam conditions to build up speed and confidence and learn to say the things that the examiner wants to hear.
there's no need to specialise in tax or audit if you don't want to as those one's are options papers. Personally I did the advanced Audit and performance management (P7 and P5) but I've also studied the tax module (P6).
At the advanced stage the audit paper is really about corporate reporting rather than audit as you are analysing accounts and trying to see where the business owner is attempting to pull the wool over your eye's. Its not like F8 which was about the mechanics of audit but rather based in real world scenarios. Just because you study audit does not mean that you will be looking to go down that path. Its real benefit is in being able to read financial statements properly abd quickly.
The advanced tax would give you an excellent grounding in the knowledgebase required of an advanced level bookkeeper where the difference between an accountant and bookkeeper is blurred to say the least.
IFA is an excellent banner to practice under and its a qualification full of ACCA people who are unable to work around regulation 8 which effectively stops you from offering anything beyond trial balance unless in a supervised capacity.
If your employer specified that you become qualified as an accountant they will mean one that is globally recognised. I know from banking that basically means ACA, ACCA or CIMA.
IFA are pretty good with exemptions as they are really pushing to get ACCA people on board. If you go down that path though you have to make a big decision as you will either only practice to trail balance, be supervised by a suitably qualified (ACA, ACCA, CIMA) accountant or step down from the ACCA as regulation 8 supecedes the rules of any other body that you are a member of.
If I were you I would continue with ACCA.
You've already passed F6. P6 is more of the same with bells on if you want to go down the tax route.
The corporate reporting paper P2 is a nasty beastie but with application its actually one of the papers with the highest pass rates
P1 should not cause you too much of a problem.
P3 and P5 are very similar papers and worth studying together (possibly with P1 as well).
I personally like P7 but its a difficult paper to pass as it is very, very time pressured and its the one where you are really looking for whats not in the question (i.e. what is the business manager not telling you, is the business performing to expectations? what is their motivation for pulling the wool? etc.). The key to that one is to watch the Mike Little lectures on Open tuition as he really brings the subject matter to life with his personal annecdotes... Actually, if you want to pass F8 study P7!
Once passed you have fullfilled your obligation to your employer to pass a quality accounting qualification and passing will give you the option of many of the others to transfer to without taking any further exams... Well, unless your doing something like moving up to ACA or accross to CIMA which has a slightly different syllabus. But the likes of IFA, AIA, UK CPA, AAT, etc. really, really want you to be with them.
Do you really want to give that up at the half way point?
You have already passed F4 which is where most people drop out. You've got used to the way that the ACCA phrase questions and the tricks and loopholes that they embed in them. If you've done F6 you can pass P6.
Come on, another push this June. Even if you've failed F8 before you'll do it this time. Just do an old paper under exam conditions every two days for a month or so before the exam.
You can still work as a bookkeeper and keep your employer happy and get those elusive letters.
As for IFA, there are a lot of people on here that have gone down that route and made very successful careers.
Worth noting that all of the BKN bookkeepers of the year to date (Frauke Golding, Liz Needam and myself) are members of the IFA.
But, good as IFA may be, it is not ACCA. If you have the chance of getting those letters do you really want to walk away from that? Far better methinks that you get the letters and then decide whether or not to trade under a flag on convenience.
Good luck with whatever you decide to do. All of the above is just my personal opinions.
kind regards,
Shaun.
p.s. amended only for spelling and grammar
-- Edited by Shamus on Tuesday 11th of March 2014 09:39:56 AM
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
Shaun the forum moderator will be the best person to advise you on this as he ACCA part qualified and a member of the IFA in practice.
Hi David,
actually... been keeping it a bit quiet on the site but I'm actually now fully ACCA.
My experience requirement to move from affiliate to membership has been accepted and (along with many others I'm sure) I'm to be ratified at the next meeting of the ACCA council on the 13th of March.
Now all I need is to work out is how to get from here to an ACCA practicing certificate!
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
Thanks so much for the reply! I am sort of torn both ways between my business and my job. I am getting sick of the exam pressure and have hardly an hour a day to study (no employer support apart from the 'you must have...) I thought if I take a step back from ACCA then achieve at least IFA Level 5 for my businesses sake (i'll only be small, one-man band type of thing!) I could maybe pick ACCA up again later. I like being my own boss - even in a limited capacity of a couple of clients.
I would love to get my ACCA but am just despairing of the time it takes to self-study around a 47.5 hour a week/40 mile commute and the rest. Ideal solution - part-time job and do both (but one at a time )
I wasn't going to blab but just read the line last night and thought, I've earned it so why the heck not.
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
I think that I came to the conclusion long ago that you can either have a life or study ACCA but not both.
Like yourself I had very little time but you learn to work around what you have.
For example, listening to BPP success CDs or Open Tuition lectures whilst commuting.
Spending dinner breaks going through decks of index cards (I never have time for lunch but I do that on the school run).
I'm a single parent and would get up at 5 to get 2 hours study in before thinking of getting my boy up for school.
If you can find just one hour a night thats an old exam paper over three days.
Your job requires you to be an accountant so there are things about it that will enhance your studies.
Answering questions on this site in many ways can be perceived as study / revision as you never know what people will ask next and everything helps ingrain your knowledge base.
If you leave ACCA with the intent of returning later I can almost guarantee that you wont, not least because the longer that you leave it the cheaper it becomes to restart from scratch than to pay all of the missed subscriptions as though you had never left.
If geneuinely you feel that you cannot give the qualification the commitment that it needs then I would first confirm with your employer that they recognise the IFA qualification.
You may actually find that a qualification such as AAT might be better for your requirements as that is often recognised where the IFA one is not.
Before changing though, just sit down with an Excel spreadsheet. Seven columns wide, 48 deep and work out over a week how much time is really commited to other stuff and where you can find the 30 mins here or hour there to fit in study? (Always factor in some down time. I always took Friday nights as computer games night)
IFA are good letters to have and they give you a lot wider scope in services that you can offer, but as said before, they will not open the doors for you that the ACCA one's will and I would hate to see you do something now that you would regret later.
kind regards,
Shaun.
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
Well done for achieving ACCA. With all those encouraging words you have just given to bbl you have even got me wondering if I should complete my CIMA qualification. I have three exams to do, but is it worth the bother at the age of 49?
With three papers to go think how many started out down the path that you are on and how few actually finish it by comparison to those that start. (although the numbers involved would still have the guys at the ICB weeping in despair, lol).
Wouldn't you rather be one of the few especially now that you are so close to the final hurdle?
I've got ACCA but I know that it won't be the last as once I've got to do CPD I would rather gain more letters than just throw money at an annual number of hours. (I'm thinking ATT next or if ever I could drop on the right training contract ACA.... OMG what have the ACCA done to me, lol).
Keep us in the loop with whatever you decide to do won't you.
kindest regards,
Shaun (new job : inspirational speech writer).
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
Congratulations Shaun!! I think it boils down to why you studying and why. If you want to stay in employment carry on with ACCA while you are earning. If you are set on being your own boss then I would suggest AAT
I was begining to think that I was never going to get there.
I really need now to sit down and come up with some sort of cunning five year plan now that I've got closure and I'm not living my life around a six monthly exam schedule.
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
congratulations Shaun- from your comments/knowledge on here I always thought you were a fully fledged chartered accountant- I am looking for my next study options- finished AAT (although taking an extra module for my benefit) and I was also looking at ATT as my next option
I'm a bit of a strange case in that I was an accountant before I was an accountant (if that makes any sense at all!).
I've been working in the field for over thirty years but mainly from the corporate side. I didn't even realise that I was working in accountancy for a large chunk of that but in hindsight all those job descriptions of business analyst, data anlyst, management consultant, project manager, etc. could for all of the financial systems that I've worked on have been described equally as well as management accountant as that was the role that I was really fulfilling.
It was a few years back when I took a permie job with one of the banks that I decided that if I wanted to climb to the top of the greasy pole then I had to have proper letters which at the time came down to either ACCA or CIMA.
I read all of the gumf and despite CIMA being more based in my world I just liked the sound of the ACCA qualification better.
The job with the bank ended when they sold my entire division to a global consultancy firm but I continued with the qualification anyway.
Despite coming from a purely management accounting background I grew to love the financial accounting side although my exam results always showed where my foundations lay.
Like yourself I'm thinking of ATT next although I've not looked into it properly yet. I know that Premier were toying with the idea but I've seen no evidence on their site of it becoming anything real yet.
That said, I self studied ACCA and if one can approach ATT in the same manner I'll probably go down that path.
How about yourself Sharon? Classroom, Distance learning or a pile of books, a study plan and a load of self determination?
kind regards,
Shaun.
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
Wow impressive! I hate the thought of management accounting-it bores me rigid!!
I started as a lowly payroll clerk working my way up to payroll management and also installing payroll systems throughout the UK for the company I worked for, took my redundancy rather than move away from my family and 'fell' into bookkeeping- did a lot of self teaching in this field before starting AAT back in 2003 -did level 2 then got so busy with lots of things including my business that I had to give it up, when the Money Laundering came into force I joined ICB as I found that to be the best option at the time for me -did their exams and then decided to go back to AAT- qualified last year (all through night class at college)but as I say I am doing the Business Tax Module as an additional course -did start this as distance learning but just couldnt get into it alone so enrolled in another college and start that in June.
Did think about ACCA but I dont know if it would really gain me any more than I have now- my business is reasonably successful-I have over 50 clients and it pays the bills and several holidays a year so do I really want the hard slog of ACCA until I am 55 only to (hopefully) retire a few years later!!
ATT appeals to me as I do enjoy taxation so may look into this once the BT is finished-its only a 7 weeks module
Sure that you would enjoy many of the Q1 scenario questions especially from the older papers before the change of examiner. But the Geeland bus company to me was a particularly good one.
Thats what management accounting is about. Not the dry rote learning that many tutors bore students to death with or formulae that are given without reasoning but rather living breathing application of common sense to improve performance by analysing, reporting, identifying issues and finding solutions.
... Is it sad that I still get excited by this stuff!
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
Hey WTG. I thought you'd gone to IFA and called it a day. Should have known better. Well done Shaun.
lol Tim,
Why be one when you can be both
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
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