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Post Info TOPIC: New Desk top required what shall I buy, help req'd from you techy bods please!


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New Desk top required what shall I buy, help req'd from you techy bods please!
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HI Everyone,

Well the time has come to buy a desktop as oppose to another laptop, my current laptop is an HP and I have had it 2 years now.  I have been relatively happy with it and it cost me a lot of money a the time as I went for a decent spec.  Unfortunately the fan has gone twice on it and now has another issue, so I am thinking of getting it repaired and keeping it as my spare, as I hardly take it out now.  So I was thinking a desk top would be great and I will get the 2 sync together, (I know someone who will do it for me), that way if one fails I have it all on the 2nd one.

So the question is what shall I buy????

Budget isn't great at the mo, but will stretch for a good machine.  I currently have windows 7.  Another reason for doing this is my really old laptop has windows Vista on it and although it is fine as a spare I certainly wouldn't want to use it a lot.  Also my son is going to have it for his school work so makes sense for me to upgrade as oppose to buying him a brand new one at the mo.

I would prefer to have a 1TB and 6 or 8GB, whatever all that is?

Any thoughts and help gratefully appreciated as I am useless when it comes to a decision on PC's.



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I use my laptop connected to an external USB keyboard and mouse, and an external 23" screen. Plus I've got the screen on the laptop as well, for when I can't see enough on the big screen! It's just like using a desktop most of the time, and Windows is clever enough to switch everything back to the laptop when I unplug it and take it out. So no need to copy data back and forth. I've also got a USB hard disk connected doing regular backups.

My latest laptop is a reconditioned Toshiba with 500Gb HDD, 6Gb RAM and a 2.5GHz processor, running Windows 7, and cost £219 a month ago (3 months warranty on the computer and 12 months on the new hard disk).

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Hi Amanda,

hope that you had a good Christmas.

I've experimented with a few different makes and models and have to say that after trying others I am unable to fault Dell XPS machines (except that you can no longer get them pre configured with windows 7 (but W8.1 that now ships is nowehere near as bad as 8 was)).

The more Ram that you can get into your machine the better. 8GB should really be looked at as the minimum.

Also ensure that you have a dedicated video card rather than on board graphics which share the RAM.

One of the best cheaper video cards available at the min (and often available in mid range machines) is the Nvidia GEFORCE GTX 750ti. Its nothing fancy but its a good robust card that will handle almost anything that you throw at it.

1tb is good but if you can get a machine with two HDD's you can set up backups from one disk to the other, just in case.

If it says anything about what I think of Dell XPS machines I've currently got four of them (two with AMD chipsets and two with Intel). And touch wood non of them have ever let me down.

Well, actually thats a lie. I've got one where the motherboard battery died (five beeps when you turn the machine on) but thats like saying a cars no good because it gets a puncture. I ended up getting that machine started then leaving it on for months just switching the monitor off at nights.

Over this hol I've sorted that one out though (unbelievable how fiddly it is removing a CMOS battery from modern machines. Ended up having to take the video card out to get at the motherboard battery properly).

Just my two penneth worth but my vote is for Dell XPS.

Shaun.

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I have a Zoostorm that works well for me, i7, 3.4 Ghz, 16G RAM, 1Tb HDD. Win 7 (I detest win 8 and 8.1 isn't that much of an improvement)
Logitech speakers, Samsung screen (second screen will be added in early 2015)
Couldn't tell you what the graphics card is, but it is quite a good one - NVIDIA I think, the computer was pitched as a 'gaming' machine - a degree in computers just taught me I know nothing, and no-one want to program in COBOL anymore :(

Computers are personal things so look around and ask questions - I happen to dislike Dell, everyone I have come across has been plagued with problems, though Shaun is not alone in his preference by any means. Shame you can't bespoke them the way you used to - too much 'mass market appeal' not enough understanding of the client base.

'Gaming' computers tend to have better graphics and higher RAM so will cope with SAGE and other heavy RAM software better. Remember that unlike a lappy you will need to add in speakers and anything else left out of the box - such as a screen and possibly all the connecting cables. It's surprising how often that can be forgotten - people are so used to tablets and lappies that are complete straight from the box.

Have fun hunting around in the January sales!

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Oh - just a thought, I don't have the second HDD that Shaun mentioned but I do have over a terabyte of cloud storage - and I back up to that regularly.

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I still want to program in COBOL Theresa... Just nobody lets me anymore.

Even when working with the banks all I get to do is tell the programmers what I want not do it myself (where's the fun in that).

It's not an art form like it used to be though, it's all by the numbers nowadays... And don't even get me onto code generators like Telon (although Scottish Widows system that generates code from structure charts is pretty cool once you get used to it).

I've got Microsoft SQL server on one of my machines and just keep thinking "Well, this crap ain't DB2 by a long stretch!".

I had the misfortune of working with some HTML programmers a little while back and they have absolutely no idea about performance. I (I assume like yourself) was brought up with the mentality of "If it doesn't perform then it doesn't work". Todays developers think that getting something to work is an end game in itself and they justify that with fast development methodologies such as Agile, Scrum and Six Sigma (as if any of those actually have any new ideas. All they do is put a name to the common sense that good IT departments have applied for years and claim it as a methodology). On the bright side of course, they can get it all wrong ten times in the time it takes me to get one system in and working using a Waterfall development approach.

Progress.... Bah Humbug.

On the Dell front, do your freinds have XPS's? I was quite specific about that over the likes of the much cheaper Optiplexes and Latitudes which I would not buy (Latitudes are the one's that you get in places like Tesco's and PC world). My preference is not so much Dell but rather one specific line of PC's from them.

One of my boys has recently bought a Mesh gaming rig which he chose the components for (they still do Bespoke rigs and you can still get Windows 7 pre installed if you want it (I do)). He's has real problems with cut outs due to overheating. I've had a look inside the box and its never going to work as the Power Supply is at the bottom of the rig rather than the top so the air flow is wrong and with the high end graphics card that he's gone for (above the PSU) he's pushing hot air that cannot escape the case fast enough down onto the CPU so overheating will be inevitable.

The whole lot of excellent top end internals needs stripping out and putting in a better case with the PSU at the top where it should be.

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My personal choice is HP followed by Acer.  I currently have a 2 year old acer (1TB 6 gig) at the office and it performs reasonably well, other than chrome and firefox being slow to load initially.

I know someone who bought a cheap zoostorm about 5 years ago and its still going strong.  It runs their sage accounts (main use) and doesn't seem to lag on the net.

As price is a main consideration that may be your best option.  There's one on ebuyer at £350 with 1TB 8 gig and a 3 gig quad core processor. Only thing I'm unsure on is the graphic card which is an AMD Radeon R7 graphics     Its windows 7 pro as well rather than 8.1



-- Edited by 111 Bookkeeping and Payroll on Saturday 27th of December 2014 11:40:31 AM

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Shamus wrote:

I still want to program in COBOL Theresa... Just nobody lets me anymore.

Even when working with the banks all I get to do is tell the programmers what I want not do it myself (where's the fun in that).

It's not an art form like it used to be though, it's all by the numbers nowadays... And don't even get me onto code generators like Telon (although Scottish Widows system that generates code from structure charts is pretty cool once you get used to it).

I've got Microsoft SQL server on one of my machines and just keep thinking "Well, this crap ain't DB2 by a long stretch!".

I had the misfortune of working with some HTML programmers a little while back and they have absolutely no idea about performance. I (I assume like yourself) was brought up with the mentality of "If it doesn't perform then it doesn't work". Todays developers think that getting something to work is an end game in itself and they justify that with fast development methodologies such as Agile, Scrum and Six Sigma (as if any of those actually have any new ideas. All they do is put a name to the common sense that good IT departments have applied for years and claim it as a methodology). On the bright side of course, they can get it all wrong ten times in the time it takes me to get one system in and working using a Waterfall development approach.

Progress.... Bah Humbug.

On the Dell front, do your freinds have XPS's? I was quite specific about that over the likes of the much cheaper Optiplexes and Latitudes which I would not buy (Latitudes are the one's that you get in places like Tesco's and PC world). My preference is not so much Dell but rather one specific line of PC's from them.

One of my boys has recently bought a Mesh gaming rig which he chose the components for (they still do Bespoke rigs and you can still get Windows 7 pre installed if you want it (I do)). He's has real problems with cut outs due to overheating. I've had a look inside the box and its never going to work as the Power Supply is at the bottom of the rig rather than the top so the air flow is wrong and with the high end graphics card that he's gone for (above the PSU) he's pushing hot air that cannot escape the case fast enough down onto the CPU so overheating will be inevitable.

The whole lot of excellent top end internals needs stripping out and putting in a better case with the PSU at the top where it should be.


Oh God.... don't get me started on the garbage they call 'modern optimisation and methodology'  Total lack of anything resembling a method and as for optimise!  Optimised for slowness and impossible to understand.  Where are this comments that explain the code?  Why are there so few simple calls, coding is not chain of consciousness stuff, some thought should go into it!  Aaagghhhh!!!!!!  Code should be elegant, functional, and easy to understand!  Optimised for speed of response which should imply short elegant solutions not rambling repetitious messes!

  

Coffee... need coffee....



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Thanks everyone for your comments, I have alot of research to do!!!

I really do hate buying a new one as I really struggle with what to buy.

Hope you all had a good Christmas and a Happy New Year to you all!

Thanks,


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HI again,

I have been looking on amazon for deals as its the sales and there are quite a few 'Freshtech AMD' I have never heard of these before, are they any good or are they rubbish?

There are quite a few Zoostorm on there at varying prices.

Very confused.com!!!!

Thanks,

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www.amazon.co.uk/Lenovo-H30-Desktop-PC-Black/dp/B00O8SED2Q/ref=dp_ob_title_ce

HI Everyone techy!

I have found this one on Amazon is it any good?


Any thoughts always appreciated even if you think it is crap!

Many thanks,
A



-- Edited by Amanda on Sunday 28th of December 2014 10:34:31 PM

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Amanda



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www.amazon.co.uk/Silent-multimedia-Sprint-H5766u-Windows/dp/B00EAJKSI6/ref=sr_1_150

Another one to look at please?

Thanks once again!

A

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Amanda wrote:

www.amazon.co.uk/Lenovo-H30-Desktop-PC-Black/dp/B00O8SED2Q/ref=dp_ob_title_ce

HI Everyone techy!

I have found this one on Amazon is it any good?


 Lenovo is the rebranded name for IBM after they sold it, and they are supposed to be good.  Plus points are Graphics Card rather than on board, and its I gig ram graphics  (that's good)  Not a bad price that Amanda, I'd give it serious consideration. Only possible drawback is Windows 8.1 instead of Windows 7  (many don't like 8.1)



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Amanda wrote:

www.amazon.co.uk/Lenovo-H30-Desktop-PC-Black/dp/B00O8SED2Q/ref=dp_ob_title_ce

HI Everyone techy!

I have found this one on Amazon is it any good?


Any thoughts always appreciated even if you think it is crap!

Many thanks,
A



-- Edited by Amanda on Sunday 28th of December 2014 10:34:31 PM


Lenovo is a rebranding of IBM PC's. Not generally regarded as the fastest PC's in the market but have a reputation for being solid, robust business machines.

Looking at that model its a small footprint box which I would imagine will make upgrading components problematic.

The 4 core processor is about 1ghz short of what you are looking for. Look for someting of at least 2.93 ghz+ (try looking for something with at least an i5 processor or if you want AMD and FX-8350 or better)

There's 1gb of dedicated graphics RAM which is only half what you would expect on modern cards. Generally I wouldn't make much of that as mostly you can just swap out the card for a better one but I worry that the small footprint of the box will mean you are pretty much stuck with whatever graphics card that the machine arrives with.

Also that model only comes with either a 180w or 240w PSU which means that you would need to also replace that to change the card and I'm not seeing that normal size PSU's are going to fit in that size box.

I wouldn't say that it is crap as its got a good heritage... But I wouldn't buy it myself.



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Hi John,

snap on what a Lenovo really is.

sorry, you hadn't replied when I started mine.

I took a bit longer in my reply as I was trying to find out what the Power Supply was in that box (got the manual from the Lenovo site).

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http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=FS-197-OP&groupid=43&catid=2477

 

I have recently bought a couple of these for work, I just went for the lowest spec with windows 7 and an optical drive, but you can up the the the storage to a TB and up the memory if needed but to be fair 4 gig will be more than enough for what you want. It comes with a three year warranty and they have some of the best customer services I've ever come across. Also they are competitively priced, trust me I spent an age comparing specs and prices and in the end it came down to warranty plus they seem to use solid parts, it will also be built by hand and tested by hand. The only thing that will be different is I get free shipping which saves £15.50, another reason I use them :)

 



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Thanks for that Steve, so basically you choose what you want and they build it??

You do realise that I will now be totally confused as to exactly what I need!

Many thanks, I know what I will be doing tonight.

Thanks,

A

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Shamus wrote:

Hi John,

snap on what a Lenovo really is.

sorry, you hadn't replied when I started mine.

I took a bit longer in my reply as I was trying to find out what the Power Supply was in that box (got the manual from the Lenovo site).


 Your reply was more comprehensive  I nearly commented on the case size for the reason you gave but as these are more common nowadays I thought maybe it was easier to get replacement components.

I'm probably out of touch but there was a time when 1 gig ram on a graphics card was the dogs.. is 2 gig more the norm now?  



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Hi John,

just been through the nightmare of trying to find the right dimensions 500w PSU for my boys pretty standard ATX case (upgrade was necessary in order to fit a GTX 750ti graphics card). For something like this small footprint case I'm suspecting that all of the compnents will be bespoke specifically for that case size. Additionally, I suspect that the PSU will only have the absolute minimum of built in power connectors for that specific machine as there is not going to be room in the box to store the extra cables.

2 gig seems to be the basic standard now on even lower end GT cards althought there are still 512kb and 1gb one's out there really for those looking for a seperate board they want 2gb dedicated RAM as a minimum for more graphics hungry applications (and also GTX as a prefix rather than GT on an Nvidia card).

One of my reasonings of going down that leg with my answers is that I know that Amanda's son will probably be the one who ends up with this machine eventually when A upgrades again so I was attempting to future proof my advice.

If its just Quickbooks / Sage and Excel spreadsheets then much less emphasis needs to be put on the seperate video card (apart from ensuring that you can run multiple monitors from it) but the 8gb of Ram on the motherboard in order to be able to manipulate several large Excel spreadsheets at the same time, possibly over a couple of good sized screens running at high resolution should not be scimped on.

Similar with the processor speed. Bettering 2.93 g/hz should be the benchmark score to aim for as with modern operating systems and all the peripheral processes that are eating up background resources the processor has a lot to do in addition to just the task that you are attempting to work on.

All the best,

Shaun.



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Could this be a touch of class



-- Edited by Artois on Wednesday 21st of February 2018 07:52:52 PM

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I would suggest so Doug. 

Edited after the spammer who thought he could dump his trash was dropped into the big rubbish dump fire pit where they belong.

I do hope Amanda got sorted in the meantime!

Loving the pic Doug - did you build that? heehee



-- Edited by Cheshire on Thursday 22nd of February 2018 09:47:05 AM

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Cheshire wrote:

Loving the pic - did you build that? heehee


 Yes, I like it as well.  



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And yours as well John. Good old fish and chips! Funny seeing both of your pics together AND both featuring a beach!

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Cheshire wrote:

And yours as well John. Good old fish and chips! Funny seeing both of your pics together AND both featuring a beach!


 Hi Joanne 

You started it with the starfish, then John with the fish and chips so I thought I would just tag along



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Cheshire wrote:

Loving the pic - did you build that? heehee


 Hi Joanne & John

Yes its the kids half term so I had to do something to keep them occupied, managed to kill a few hours but it was a bit awkward having to build it standing on my head!

Do you reckon it will qualify for zero-rating?



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Cheshire wrote:

And yours as well John. Good old fish and chips! Funny seeing both of your pics together AND both featuring a beach!


 When I saw your starfish I wanted to do something seasidey, and whenever I go to the seaside, it has to be fish and chips, you can't beat them.

One year me and my son had just purchased them and he put them down on a wall so he could jump down from it.  A seagull swooped down and nicked his fish! it was hilarious.



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Artois wrote:
Do you reckon it will qualify for zero-rating?

 Hi Doug

providing you got planning permission yes.  You can also claim demolition at zero rate if there was an existing structure there before. Seaweed can't be claimed though as that's plant hire.



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Leger wrote:
Artois wrote:
Do you reckon it will qualify for zero-rating?

Seaweed can't be claimed though as that's plant hire.


 Nice one laughing.gif



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Ooh, this thread takes me back. Since my last post my boys had a completely new PC and the PSU (and video card) from his is now inside my box.... Now, according to that posters client the other day I can bill myself for that repair! lol

Liking the plant hire quip.

Not so much liking that my last post is now marked as VEIS (cos I deleted the wee miscreants advertising).


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Shamus wrote:

Not so much liking that my last post is now marked as VEIS (cos I deleted the wee miscreants advertising).


All changed now, don't want to get on the wrong side of the law 



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Lol Doug. :)

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I had to edit mine as well, as it wouldnt have made sense after you edited yours Doug. So 'whats new?' my son would say to me not talking sense.

The pic had me thinking of Ripley's Believe it or Not museum, although clearly my memory is failing as its actually the Wonderworks one

Related image

 

Lol John, very clever  - again!!!!



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Hey guys

There's another pic further upthread of little ole me (without fish and chips) taken on the beach at Bournemouth, quite a few years ago.  Just spotted it scrolling down. 



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Leger wrote:

Hey guys

There's another pic further upthread of little ole me (without fish and chips) taken on the beach at Bournemouth, quite a few years ago.  Just spotted it scrolling down. 


 I mentioned that at 17.43 yesterday.  

When I read your post today I thought I had typed it but then not posted. confusebiggrin



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Derrr....oh yeah.

I read the post yesterday and thought you meant mine and Doug's posts.  It makes more sense now smile



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Leger wrote:

Derrr....oh yeah.

I read the post yesterday and thought you meant mine and Doug's posts.  It makes more sense now smile


Hi John, I must confess I thought the same as you originally and it wasn't till later when I scrolled up and saw your audition for Baywatch that the penny dropped of what Joanne meant

Hi Joanne, great photo is that a real place then ?



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Artois wrote:

it wasn't till later when I scrolled up and saw your audition for Baywatch that the penny dropped of what Joanne meant


Would you believe they turned me down!!!   There was me, hoping to become Britain's answer to David Hasselhoff, and they gave the gig to an unknown called Dwayne Johnson.



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How could they John!!! I might start a petition!

Doug - yes for real. Its in Orlando, although I didnt go to this place when I was over there! Only the Americans hey! www.wonderworksonline.com/orlando/

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Lol,

Thailand is going through a fad with these things. I've been through one and it does your head in to start with. Cleverest part for me is how they get soft furnishings and clothes to lie so naturally the wrong way up. i.e.

Related image



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I could tell you the tricks of the trade, but dont want to spoil the fun for when you go back. Only the Americans and the Thais then!



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