Through experience I have gained experience in all aspects of accounts, through to draft if that is what the client prefers but as Im not qualified and only starting self employed I wont know everything so it would be great to get someone who could help
Hi. Well without bona fide experience, ACCA is impossible to study if you are self employed, and, offering more than bookkeeping and VAT. Look in at the AAT and the IAB. If you want a chartered qualification whilst being self employed look at CIMA. AIA is also a great institute to be a part of.
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Johnny - Owner of an overly-active keyboard.
A man who can read, yet doesn't, is in no way wiser than a man who can't.
Hi Lesley Ann
I did respond to your email but have not yet received a response - did you get it?
I am also a wee bit confused - are you actually a student member of the ACCA already as your first post above seems to suggest that. Although I got the impression you were a student member of the ICB? Can you clarify and then perhaps we can help.
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Joanne
Winner of Bookkeeper of the Year 2015, 2016 & 2017
Thoughts are my own/not to be regarded as official advice,which should be sought from a suitably qualified Accountant.
You should check out answers with reference to the legal position
Sorry, I am a student to ACCA but also decided to study ICB so I can at least have that qualification under my belt
I just dot know which route is better for me, what have you studied Joanne
x
expanding a little on what Johnny has said above the issue is that if you join the ACCA as a student you are ACCA and it really doesn't matter what any other body will allow you to do as being a member of the ACCA takes precedent.
As a student or even a member pre practice certificate the only services that one is allowedd to offer on a freelance basis (no matter who else you are with) is bookkeeping to trial balance, VAT and Payroll.
An added complication there as well is that if you are working for an employer who goes beyond the allowed services they must be a suitably qualified employer otherwise you would still be in breach of regulation 8.
As an example. There are many accountants qualified by experience. ACCA would regard them as unqualified meaning that as a student you would be the most qualified person in the form so effectively supervising yourself. In such instance if you go beyond trial balance you would risk being fined and expelled from membership.
I know that there are posts on other sites (I squish them on this site) where people are ACCA and have joined ICB believing that they are allowed to practice up to the level of any of their qualifications so if ICB allows them to do more than ACCA they believe that such is reasonable reasoning for offering the extra services.
The reality as stated above is that if one chooses to be ACCA then their rules take precedence and one would be allowed to practice under other peoples flags only up to the level that ACCA allow under theirs. So, you could be an MICB only allowed to do bookkeeping.
Now, I know that many will see that as being unfair, however ACCA don't get to keep their name as being amongst the best by allowing people to practice fully before they are equiped for the role and whilst bodies such as the ICB allow people to prepare accounts ask yourself. How can one get from nothing to being able to prepare accounts with the ICB in a few months where the ACCA will take 5+ years (generally nearer to 10).
If you cannot wait to work under an ACCA banner have you thought about doing AAT instead? You will find it accepted by far more accountants and could lead to being offered a training position at which point you could start your journey towards ACCA?
If you really want ACCA then you need to think about whether your business can survive offering restricted services (non accounts, no filing, no advice).
Sorry, I really do appreciate the conundrum but as Johnny says, it's better to know this now than when you are looking at expulsion and a £1200 fine. (And if you are thrown out of one professional body you may find yourself expelled / prevented from joining any of the others).
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
Might find that ICB have issues with your practising when only a student member, although I have no clue what their rules state. But you being a member of ACCA is a major issue if you go beyond Trial Balance as detailed above.
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Joanne
Winner of Bookkeeper of the Year 2015, 2016 & 2017
Thoughts are my own/not to be regarded as official advice,which should be sought from a suitably qualified Accountant.
You should check out answers with reference to the legal position
Shaun, I did question ACCA on this a while ago, when I was trying to decide what further qualifications to do. I am full MICB with practice licence and they advised that becoming a student member of ACCA would not affect my current services under ICB.
I completely agree with Joanne, I fear that you are a victim of the ICB telling everyone that they are a bookkeeping organisation (where bookkeeping ends at trial balance).
I've only seen the ICB mentioned once by the FRC and it was described as a bookkeeping organisation where members prepare clients books up to trial balance.
I genuinely think that if you found someone at the ACCA who had heard of the ICB then they will have shared the FRC's expectation that if you have a bookkeeping qualification then you do bookkeeping. If you only do bookkeeping then you are working within the remit of regulation 8 sdo you are ok.
If you told the person at ACCA that you could prepare / file accounts under the ICB then they would tell you that you cannot whilst you are a member, even a student member, of the ACCA.
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
I did specify that I was doing self assessment tax returns etc. They said if I fully disclosed on application it should not affect it. I don't know whether the person I was talking to got it wrong, or if it's different if you are doing it prior to study. I don't know...
Anyhow I decided to got AAT route in any case. May go and try for charted in the future.
No, sorry not different if you are doing it prior to study. It's clear from the link above, plus the few hundred page send you to sleep read regs you can further link to. Plus you can see it mentioned on her and AWEB time and time again. Think AAT is a good move from ICB, but watch out for their regs too. You might need to ask for a copy from them direct as just now they seem to have disappeared from their website.
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Joanne
Winner of Bookkeeper of the Year 2015, 2016 & 2017
Thoughts are my own/not to be regarded as official advice,which should be sought from a suitably qualified Accountant.
You should check out answers with reference to the legal position
Can someone private message me with contact information, I would like to speak with you further as I don't want to be wasting time or money on the wrong course
but doesn't that move away from the point of a forum in that we are attempting to help all readers not just one.
If threads are taken off line then the site would cease to be the resource for the profession and those just thinking of joining the proifession that it is.
kindest regards,
Shaun.
p.s. if anyone does take this thread off line please also post whatever advice you give on here.
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
There is so much information on this post, I personally don't know what course is best for me so I thought if I spoke to someone who knew the ins and outs of it all it would help me that's all
General rule of thumb. Do AAT and talk to Nick or Neil at First Tuition as your first port of call.
You can practice in a limited manner making no mention of the AAT whilst you train but as soon as you move from student to member you cannot practice beyond trial balance until you have achieved MIP status.
ACCA regulation 8 prevents you from offering services beyond trial balance whilst you train (and for a good while beyond) so if you need to practice to support your training that is unlikely to be an option to you (refer to above discussions).
Later you could move up to ACCA is you can find a suitably qualified accountant to take you under their wing.
Thats my opinion but others may disagree.
HTH,
Shaun.
p.s. going out to a clients in a min so will catch up later.
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
If you go offline how can you know the info is correct? If it's in the open, it's open to scrutiny. The long and short of it is, if you want to be self employed and offer a full accounts package, forget ACCA. ICAEW is impossible less you've a training contract. CIMA you can study just don't mention you're a student of CIMA. AAT same as CIMA. With no bona fide experience you'll need to either get MLR cover from HMRC, plus insurance OR belong to a bookkeeping institute. Once you have self employed experience, you can, after completing AAT apply for MAAT MIP status. You can also work towards CIMA MIP status but you'll need a CIMA or chartered to sign off your work. If you study CIMA, join branch events, you'll network amongst other MIPS. Other route is ATT, again requires 2 years experience, can be earned through self employment.
-- Edited by abacus12345 on Monday 7th of March 2016 01:34:53 PM
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Johnny - Owner of an overly-active keyboard.
A man who can read, yet doesn't, is in no way wiser than a man who can't.
There is so much information on this post, I personally don't know what course is best for me so I thought if I spoke to someone who knew the ins and outs of it all it would help me that's all
Hi Lesley Ann
Might be an idea, as I think I suggested to you earlier, to share your background on here as then perhaps more specific information can be given. Eg - aspirations within the industry, learning background to date, any experiences working with other Accounting professionals, age (sorry to say, but this one is key in that you could be considered too old to do certain higher level training as the possibilities of getting training contracts are more remote. Do-able - possibly, but much harder!), perhaps even the reasoning behind your aspirations, qualifications to date, preferred learning styles.
Obviously I understand if you dont want to share all that lot with a bunch of strangers then thats fine. In which case I would suggest a couple of things - absolutely have a chat with Nick or Neil at First Intuition as Shaun suggests (both on here and both winners of awards (see banner across the top of the site). Also - have a good root around the site as there are lots of threads where people have asked for the exact same advice and some very detailed answers have been given. (might confuse you more though so be warned! lol. Might arm you with some more questions so feel free to post.) Do a search for things like AAT or ACCA; ICB or AAT - that kind of thing.
We dont bite! Well - not often.
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Joanne
Winner of Bookkeeper of the Year 2015, 2016 & 2017
Thoughts are my own/not to be regarded as official advice,which should be sought from a suitably qualified Accountant.
You should check out answers with reference to the legal position
