a subject here that we have covered before but time methinks for a fresh thread as time and software moves on.
I had a sales call from BTC this week and as a result trialed their software.
I had heard that it worked very well with VT but personally where I find VT straight forwards and intuitive I could not say the same for BTC despite the CT option also being an Excel add in similar to VT Accounts. Despite their shared look (and indeed shared menu bar within Excel) they do not seem to work as well together and I saw no automatic transfer of data between packages that I was expecting to find.
That is nothing against the software and I'm sure that some people may like it. It just wasn't for me as I did not find it intuitive or as integrated as I had hoped.
I then trialed Taxfiler which, even though its cloud based I liked, not least as there was no holding data to ransom. The demo with that one uses large amounts of trial data giving a real feel of a working accounts office and you can see at a glance what needs doing.
That of course is just two bits of software. What are others currently using, would you recomend your software to other site members and if so why?
Lets cap the software cost for this survey at a maximum of £800 per year for unlimited clients and must cover companies, sole traders and partnerships.
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
Hi Shaun. I like Taxcalc - I will use the accounts production offerings in the near future also. It's simple, clean, effective, gets the job done nicely. From TB upwards, I've not seen anything equal to, or better than taxcalc ATM. There are less expensive offerings available, some free HMRC also, which do the job, just. I like the look of IRIS and CCH too, yet as we know, they aren't cheap. In the future, who knows what XERO and other equivalents will offer?
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Johnny - Owner of an overly-active keyboard.
A man who can read, yet doesn't, is in no way wiser than a man who can't.
We currently use VT Transaction + alongside Excel 2016 but have used most of the other major competitors. Value for money is exceptional, but the choice has not been just about that. We like to control our software, and do not need whistles and bells. If you have a good understanding of double entry book keeping and are not dependent on stock control or flat rate VAT its perfect. However, there is a simple workaround to cover flat rate VAT. How could it be improved, well a VAT flat rate option and filing CT600s would be good but I don't think that's on the cards.
Payroll
Not my favorite task, this is dealt with by another partner. However again we have tried various software packages but Payroll Manager fills all our needs. Technical support is good but I think it's only been needed twice in 3 years. Payslips can be printed on plain paper with your Practice full details and logo.
VAT
We use the HMRC filing software from the VAT reports produced by VT transactions+
Tax Return production- sole and partnerships
We have been with Taxcalc from the start when the software was originally produced by "Which". although we have trailed numerous other packages. So why Taxcalc as there are not the cheapest by far? The answer is simple; you get what you pay for. The support is exceptional, and they really do listen. I like the Hub, and these ease of importing associated data from linked files. The switch between simple step and HMRC Forms is ideal when new Regulations come in force, simply to see that it looks "right".
Account Production
Well VT Transactions + produces perfect accounts. However, on some of our more complex Companies I prefer to use Taxcalc Account Production, which is then imported into the CT600 software. Maybe overkill but this is limited to maybe 10 clients, with VT being perfect for the other clients.
Corporation Tax CT600
Again we fall back to Taxcalc. It's a pleasure to use, as simple as that. However quite expensive if you have just a few Ltd Companies and previously used the free HMRC software.
Total £1012, sorry to have gone over the limit but it may be smaller practices will use the option of reducing costs due to less clients, available with most software, to bring it below £800?
-- Edited by Jay on Sunday 3rd of April 2016 04:17:22 PM
-- Edited by Jay on Sunday 3rd of April 2016 04:18:28 PM
There is a current thread on accountingweb-Taxfiler V Taxcalc and although I have only had a quick look at Taxfiler I like what I see. I currently use Taxcalc for accounts production and CT returns so am not sure of their partnership and sole trader prices but would guess that it would exceed £800 all in. I will be asking Taxcalc at Accountex next month why I should renew with them in July rather than moving to Taxfiler at a fraction of the price.
They had me at "The SA100 and SA800 take a feed from VT" and "Data can be transferred from VT with a few mouse clicks" which is the whole reason that I was trialing BTC as I thought that was what that was supposed to be able to do!
For £180 plus VAT per year for unlimited filings and unlimited clients its also less than a quarter of the cost of BTC or a third of the cost of Taxcalc.
I do like the look of Taxcalc though and its software that I've used before.
Hi Jay,
The £800 was just for the tax software so you're still well within.
Personally I've not come accross any scenarios that VT Accounts cannot handle yet although I don't currently have any clients larger than £650k turnover so I'm only really looking at small clients at the moment.
On the Payroll front I've been taking another look at MoneySoft Payroll manager myself as I've noticed that it seems to have overtaken 12pay (my current software) as peoples Payroll software on the site.
With the exception of you also using TaxCalc accounts we have the same approach for Bookkeeping, VAT and Accounts.
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
I looked at BTC a couple of years ago. A helpful company who went out of their way for me. They knew I had very few Ltd Co's and were prepared to offer a reduced fee accordingly, so kudo's there.
I trialled the software but simply could not get to grips with it. Despite saying it needed VT accounts which I was familiar with, it just didn't work how I expected it to.
So I continued with HMRC filing until last year when I used Andica (doesn't meet your criteria as this one was just 5 Ltd Co's for £72) It was ok but I had to do a work round to file an accounting period of more than a year (thanks Michelle who helped me with that)
I then used Tax Filer to do a couple of SA's in January and I was suitably impressed. Will be using it for a Ltd Co later this week so I'll see how that goes.
So I have VT accounts @ £180.00
Payroll Manager @ £144.00
Tax Filer @ £144.00 (max 50 a year but I will be under that, otherwise its £216 for unlimited - still a cracking price)
Total £468 that'll do me
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John
Any advice given is for general guidance and professional advice should be sought applicable to your circumstances.
I cant comment at the moment as we use IRIS which we pay more than £800 per month for.
When i started out 3 and a bit years ago I used VT for accounts and taxcalc for tax returns but never really liked VT so after a year or so moved accounts to Taxcalc. Liked Taxcalc for the accounts and tax module for the following reasons
1. Runs really fast
2. You can have more than one company open at one time.
3. Filing at CH and HMRC is really easy and you have nice clean easy to understand filing confirmations.
4. Tax return has simplestep guide to easy take you through tax return.
5. Can link Ltd Co accounts to CT600 and push the info across.
6. Can run personal tax return, tax schedules and tax comp as one document for sending to client.
7. Shows you at a glance the PT or CT due in box in top right corner
8. Gives you heads up things that might be wrong in account and tax returns.
The tax hub gives basic practice management functionality and if they improved that then might consider moving back but IRIS is the market leader and price it is for a reason. It is the best fully integrated package out there IMO.
If you are one man bad with less than 100 clients then you dont need it but we are a 5 member firm now with over 200 clients so the PM functionality is invaluable. Would recommend taxcalc for any one man band starting out.
Other stuff we use.
1. Moneysoft for payroll - we outsource all payrolls with employees other than directors and do director only payrolls inhouse. Though from new tax year we will either outsource all payroll or will get a dedicated payroll person in to run the payroll inhouse (have spoken to a couple of people who used to work beside who are interested in taking on, on a part time basis)
2. AVN - we are full members of AVN and will be pushing this to clients this year.
3. Xero for bookkeeping for clients. Will be pushing add ons this year such as receipt bank, datamolino, crunchboards etc.
4. Inform Direct - for company secretarial work. Also gives a clear look of the accounts filing and annual returns due. IRIS also gives us this but prefer inform direct for this.
5. Docusoft - document management system. All emails, mail and accounts, tax returns etc get saved here.
6. Taxcalc - use ths VAT filer module here. Could use HMRC website but prefer to use taxcalc.
7. Hellosign - use this to electronically sign documents eg engagement letters, fee quotes, accounts, CT returns, VAT returns, personal tax returns etc but will be moving to IRIS openspace as will seamlessly link to accounts and tax returns.
8. IRIS - use following modules; accounts production, personal tax, business tax, automail, time and fees, practice management. Not full set up automail yet but will be doing that over the next few weeks to streamline the accounts and tax finalising process.
Next for consideration is moving hosting to cloud with hosted desktop. Recently changed server and has caused us a few problems and a bit of downtime. Like the idea of being able to log in from any browser straight to your desktop and leave all the IT function to them.
We also use few other pieces of software
1. GoToMeeting for online meetings with clients. Considering using this to send video explaining accounts and tax return to client rather than bland emails.
2. Survey Monkey - recently sent survey to clients to get their feedback on various things.
3. Dragon Dictate - to dictate documents rather than typing them.
We are also going to trial about 140 free online tools/software that we have a list of to see if any of them will be any use to us.
-- Edited by MarkS on Sunday 3rd of April 2016 09:39:18 PM
Hi Mark,
I use Hoted Desktop UK and I can recommend them. The help desk is great if there is ever a problem and what I particularly like is that they will do the Iris updates which I used to dread doing. My one slight reservation is that you don't have access rights so you need to get their guys to put any software/updates on. This is rarely a problem unless something unforeseen happens like you get them to update Sage Payroll for the new tax year and have to be up early to do someones payroll because you promised to have it ready first thing and sage then have a mandatory update which wasn't picked up! This happened to me last week but the tech guys had it sorted for me by around 9.15am...top guys.
Hi Jo, yes having everything hosted depends on having good internet connection so wouldn't recommend to anyone in a poorly serviced area. Otherwise a great option if you need to work from home or if you are going away.
I think there might be s skeleton support on for weekends but not totally certain, I'll look into it.
Hi Mark Only one I'm unsure of is AVN. Thought they were a tax 'mitigation' company to be honest.....what software do they provide/what does it do?
They offer a whole lot of stuff, off the top of my head
1. Times Up - enables you to price with a propsective client or existing client based on exactly what they need and will churn out a price at 3, 4 or 5 staf level
2. Remuneration Planner - idenfity the most efficient way to extract funds from a ltd company based on its own unique circumstances
3. Incorporation Planner - review whether tax efficient or not for a unincorporated business to incorporate.
4. On Track - Key Performance improvements that can be made by a business based on their own circumstances
6. Benchmarking - Benchmarking report highlighting how business compares against competitors against 19 measurable items.
7. PMI (Performance Measurement Information) - 8 step process that you can use with clients to help them proactively grow their business
8. Lifetime Financial Responsibility - Identify where a client wants to be in 10-20 years time and help them get their tax efficiently.
9. Personal Balance Sheet - review the personal position of a client for IHT review purposes and also can assist tax return preparation.
10. SSTW (Simple Stuff That Works) Giving ideas to clients to help them grow their business.
11. One Page Plans - Summarising client business and key drivers in one page summary and looking at what if scenarios with Success Driver Map.
Then they have the vanilla and advanced tax planning links. Recently had a couple of clients looking to shelter £100k+ in profits tax efficiently.
Hi Mark, I use Hoted Desktop UK and I can recommend them. The help desk is great if there is ever a problem and what I particularly like is that they will do the Iris updates which I used to dread doing. My one slight reservation is that you don't have access rights so you need to get their guys to put any software/updates on. This is rarely a problem unless something unforeseen happens like you get them to update Sage Payroll for the new tax year and have to be up early to do someones payroll because you promised to have it ready first thing and sage then have a mandatory update which wasn't picked up! This happened to me last week but the tech guys had it sorted for me by around 9.15am...top guys.
Thanks Rob
Have only heard good things about Hosted Desktop UK and given that IRIS uses them for their hosting gives confidence that will do what we need.
My IT guy says people that have tried hosted have always went back to server but Hosted Desktop seems to work well for accountants as most of their clients are accountants so might be the option for us.
Would rather someone just takes care of everything without any problem in the background.
MarkS wrote:Recently had a couple of clients looking to shelter £100k+ in profits tax efficiently.
Mossack Fonseca?
Lol, just joshin. The timing was too good to pass up though.
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
Hi Jo, yes having everything hosted depends on having good internet connection so wouldn't recommend to anyone in a poorly serviced area. Otherwise a great option if you need to work from home or if you are going away. I think there might be s skeleton support on for weekends but not totally certain, I'll look into it.
Thanks Rob, look forward to an update. Was just talking to someone today as it happens, who is interested. (Not a client). I live in an area of very good connection but I have had to manage with no internet for three weeks after some dosey bod did something bad to the BT wiring box down the road! So always have to consider contingency plans, which usually consists of turfing my Dad off his PC!
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Joanne
Winner of Bookkeeper of the Year 2015, 2016 & 2017
Thoughts are my own/not to be regarded as official advice,which should be sought from a suitably qualified Accountant.
You should check out answers with reference to the legal position
