"If they have basic online Banking they can get an A4 pdf from NatWest.   If they are a bigger company they can actually get NatWests Bankline product - now depending on what version of that they get, Bankline does a data dump that can go straight into Sage, in a variety of formats."

They do have Bankline - and they do now have statements downloaded from that rather than paper ones sent in the post. (In fact it's me that downloads them.)

Way, way back, though - when you downloaded an A4 PDF statement, it was just the A5 version blown up to A4, which was laughable. I remember commenting (aka taking the piddle) about it on Twitter, with an @ mention for one of Natwest's feeds.

(Just to illustrate the scope of the problem when they were getting paper statements, I would struggle to fit one year's worth of sheets - on just the main bank account - into a single lever arch file. I know there are files you can get that would allow a two sheet approach, one top, one bottom - but IMO when dealing with sequential sheets, those are inefficient and flawed.)

Even now, there are still limitations with Bankline - IIRC, the statements are essentially a list of transactions in a set order (most recent first) with no option to sort them into any other order. (Which some time ago led to another piddle taking Twitter comment - suggesting that if their developers don't know how to sort, the dead simple bubble sort is easy to learn.)

I didn't realise there were different versions of Bankline - so perhaps other [more expensive] versions are better.

On the flip side, I like that Bankline can be set up such that I can set up payments, but the director has to authorise them - equivalent to him signing the cheques. I find that lacking with the HSBC online banking for another client; they wanted me to do payments for them (they know I do at the other client - almost all of my lot know each other) but with HSBC, if I set up a payment, that payment goes out. End of - no oversight.

I've therefore refused to do it autonomously - and instead devised a sort of reverse authorisation system; they have a list of items due, and can select some, click a button, and I'll get an email saying "Pay these..." - but they haven't once used it, despite saying "Oh, that's a good idea..." when first set it up and gave them access. (They like it because it's online, and they worship at the Altar of the Cloud God.)

abacus12345 wrote:

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Thanks John - something I'll remember to look out for. Are you a sage man yourself? Or do you use a collection of various software?

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 Hi Johnny

3 experiences of sage.  1st was in 2006/7 when I was in charge of the bookkeeping where I worked.  Then again in 2008 when I was asked to oversee the bookkeeping for a conservatory company.  They were using Quickbooks but I wasn't keen on it, so switched them to Sage when they went Ltd.  The last instance was 2012-16 when I did the year ends for a company at their premises  (that's the one I was referring to)

The software I use in my own business is VT Transaction +  Initially that was on cost alone, as there was no way as a fledgling business I could afford sage prices!  But I fell in love with it (cue Romeo & Juliet theme) and now that is my software of choice.  I did like Sage, but found it unyielding in parts, whereas in VT+ you can just delate something and redo it (although I think Sage has changed since) 

abacus12345 wrote:

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Awesome thread! Thanks guys :) Yes Joanne a day helping you sort Sage would have been ace! Around here people are secluded and hidden away when it comes to seeking advise, maybe it is the competition element ha. So early this morning (hooked lol) I sourced an adequate TB together with customer details - I load up Sage, create customers, suppliers, bank cash etc. Head into the COA, change xyz to suit, then over to company to create a few nominals - after a few wrong turns, I discover opening balances in the top tool bar - I think oooo this looks good! I work down the list entering customers, suppliers etc, then on to the reversal as prompted - I begin to enter my TB, all is good, it is out by my debtors and creditors so I enter those, now all is in balance - I check Sage TB, it is in balance, but over stated - now I performed two journals, one into SLCA from sundry debtors and the other you know :) Is this a correct move? Everything appeared ace after that. Thank you :)

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 Hi Johnny

Sorry for the delay in responding  - not been able to come onto the site for a few days! Been mega busy with work stuff.  Must admit - I was thinking that this blinkin post is getting a little like using AWEB - all that scrolling!  

You should be able to access opening balances in I think three different ways from memory - the tool bar across the top, which you found.  Also - via the set up wizard which you may have used for each supplier/customer.   Or just each of the customer/supplier records.

When doing opening balances I tend to:-

Create opening balances for each customer/supplier via their own records screens.  I put invoice/credit note numbers in alongside the narrative O/Bal (if I feel like it!).  This method automatically creates entries in the debtors and creditor control accounts and the opposite to suspense (9998).

Then key your opening trial balance in full, via the journal screen.

Then, yes the balances in the debtor/creditor control are doubled up, so just reverse the journals from the TB via the suspense account - this brings the suspense account to nil.  Run 'b/forward' TB (this is right at the very top when you order the report date info) - check and it should match your original TB.

Couple of extra bits - for the Bank - key the actual statement balance, then on the same O/Bal journals, key all the unreconciled items, just helps when you want to do a bank rec later.  Some advocate keying the TB bank balance and then ignoring the previously unreconciled items when you get your Bank statement, but this can get messy if some takes an age to come through and can be unwiedly.

Also when keying opening journals to the sales/purchase tax control accounts key as T1, rest as T9, so they pick up automatically in the VAT routine, otherwise you would need to do an adjustment when you run the return.

Have to look at other stuff later - must get some work done

abacus12345 wrote:

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Thank you for that :) so either is correct as long as you remain constant. Can I save report designs and COA to use in another company? I had a issue whereby I couldn't display PL and BS, yet TB was displaying fine. I figured I'd not completely arranged the COA correctly, after playing with the nominals - all was fine after a play.

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The only annoying aspect, up to yet - Is the basic missing nominals, for instance sales / purchase returns, now I'm sure a DR or CR (To represent a return) to the sales / purchase a/c is enough, yet get it to show in the P/L and new nominal is needed. That is fine, but, is there a way to create one big block of nominals, save them, and reuse on the next company?

In fairness to Sage, doing it one of three ways will give the same bottom-line figures. It is more about design together with creating something that is easier to read for those who don't know what I've performed.

Suppose that is just being picky now ;)

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Report designer isn't really my thing, but I believe it is easy to save / copy report designs to use them with other companies.

Regarding the COA, there are a couple of ways of re-using COAs that I've seen. First, for new companies, you are prompted for what type of company it is when you are performing the initial setup. The defaults applied in each case come from XML files supplied by Sage (see screen shot).

One of the options is your own COA (OwnCOA.XML). Rather than tinkering with any of the standard ones, you can replace the contents of OwnCOA.XML with the contents of, say, LimitedCompany.XML and add any additional accounts you want as standard to the file. If you create companies using this XML file, they'll all have the custom COA layout you've specified. 

A bit more off-piste (and definitely worthy of the familiar backup, backup, backup warning) for existing companies, is to replace the n.COA file in your ACCDATA directory for the company with the n.COA file from the ACCDATA directory of the company whose COA structure you want to replicate in your company (where n is the COA number).

Here's the idea, say Company A has a COA you'd like to use in Company B. Both companies just have a single COA (1.COA). You can create a new empty COA in Company B (2.COA) and then replace the 2.COA file in Company B with a copy of the 1.COA file from Company A renamed as 2.COA. Later, you can delete the first COA in Company B via Sage if You're sure all is as you want it. ALWAYS run the check COA function in Company B in Sage if you do this sort of thing.  

This sort of thing can be handy in Group company situations where you want to co-ordinate the COAs of six or seven companies without having to replicate the same edits six or seven times.

Food for thought.

Regards,

abacus12345 wrote:

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It is because I create great threads        Its driving me nuts, especially on my ipad and even worse on the tiny screen on my phone, but at least it doesnt have the annoying bounce/white wasted screen nonsense of AWeb.    

     

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Having had a play, I was sort of finding more than one way to do things, wondering if this is the correct way to perform xyz. 

 

The only annoying aspect, up to yet - Is the basic missing nominals, for instance sales / purchase returns, now I'm sure a DR or CR (To represent a return) to the sales / purchase a/c is enough, yet get it to show in the P/L and new nominal is needed.  Maybe something to do with your sage type ie instant.       But it only takes a couple of seconds to set up new nominals.   Depends what the customer wants to have reported which I think is why its not a standard but I could be completely wrong on that score.  That is fine, but, is there a way to create one big block of nominals, save them, and reuse on the next company?  Ive not tried what Ian has suggested.  Other way is to set up your noms, incorporate into existing COA and do as an amended one. Save. Backup up ( as many times as Ian suggests).  Open new company, restore to that one.  Then back that one up - but making sure (1) you have enough compaany licence thingies and (b) you then change your name on the backups for company two and change the name in your configuration etc settings.

 

In fairness to Sage, doing it one of three ways will give the same bottom-line figures. It is more about design together with creating something that is easier to read for those who don't know what I've performed.

 

Suppose that is just being picky now ;)       God, thats not picky.  Wait til you get going with real clients and see how picky you get!

 

Thanks 

 

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Onion4Sage wrote:

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Cheshire wrote:

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When doing opening balances I tend to:-

Create opening balances for each customer/supplier via their own records screens.  I put invoice/credit note numbers in alongside the narrative O/Bal (if I feel like it!).  This method automatically creates entries in the debtors and creditor control accounts and the opposite to suspense (9998).

Then key your opening trial balance in full, via the journal screen.

Then, yes the balances in the debtor/creditor control are doubled up, so just reverse the journals from the TB via the suspense account - this brings the suspense account to nil.  Run 'b/forward' TB (this is right at the very top when you order the report date info) - check and it should match your original TB.

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Hi Joanne,

I operate the same way with one small change to the highlighted instruction.

Then key your opening trial balance in full, via the journal screen, substituting suspense (9998) for the debtors control and creditors control nominal codes.  No idea why I didnt even think of that, Ive just done a mammoth one too!!!!!  Doh!  Although now you mention it.....yep just checked two I did about 12months ago and that is exactly what I did.  Think Im losing the plot!!!!!!!

That means there's no doubling up and no journal to do. 

Journals posted to the control accounts gave me so much grief when developing Onion that I break out in a cold sweat when I see JD or JC in the transaction history for them! Oh I get  you there - I found a pile of journals on suspense from a prior bookkeeper that made no actual sense to anything that shouldve been keyed, then there were random posting to cash account/sales and allsorts just to put through the 'balancing' item.  Massive amount of unravelling had to be done before I could do the year end. Nightmare!

Regards, 

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abacus12345 wrote:

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Hi Guys,

Thank you very much for your information.

I like the idea of creating the COA + Nominals, backing up and reusing. At the moment I only have Sage instants single licence so I can not try that to its full effect.

When using Sage 50 multiple, will performing a back up, back up all companies, or just the one you are currently in?

Thanks

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I back up the one Im in - always, at the very least, as I close sage down for that client.  I keep a list or annotate the backup at the end of the date info as to what Ive back it up for at certain points too eg post VAT return to xx date - just helps me that one.  

Dont forget to always do your error checking first when it gives you the option and always run this if you get an unexpected shut down.    My latest sage nightmare client when I first took them on I couldnt use sage for 3 weeks as it wouldnt run the error routine on their system, but it when it finally did on a newly created/restored file had 46000 errors!  It wasnt posting one half of the double entry on all invoices raised when posted, never mind some of the other rubbish that was happening.  They hadnt backed up for YEARS!!!!!!!!

Once I enable the staff to use the new sage, they will have instructions to back it up daily at the end of the day as a minimum and woe betide them the first time they dont!!!!!!!!!

abacus12345 wrote:

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The learning never ends if we persevere.

Plus the sense of accomplishment when you had sorted it out!

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 or when the invoice is paid!  

Can I just have a RANT about Royal Mail - Ive waited in all bloody day and  they havent delivered my re-delivery item despite me having confirmations that they will.  ALL DAY Ive waited!!!!!!!!!!!!!    USELESS BUNCH.

abacus12345 wrote:

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At the moment I only have Sage instants single licence so I can not try that to its full effect.

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Hi Johnny,

Just in case you, or anyone reading this, ever decide to try the XML route, bear in mind that you can load in your OwnCOA.XML definitions into new Practice Company build to get a feel for it. Available in Sage Instant too.

Regards,

abacus12345 wrote:

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Thank you.

I shall have a play!

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Johnny,

A way to have a play for an existing company in Instant (backup, backup, backup) is to create a new blank COA in Sage to create a n+1.COA file in the ACCDATA folder. Then delete the n+1.COA file and rename a copy of n.COA as n+1.COA. n is the number of the COA you want to base your new COA on. Then you can apply your adjustments to this COA and use it alongside your existing default COA until you feel totally comfortable with making it your default COA.

Regards,