A quick intro as this place seems a bit more friendly than some forums!
I've just completed AAT L3 and I'm now exploring the idea of starting a little practice while completing L4 and working. Although just qualified I've been completing the bookkeeping for my own businesses for about 16 years, those have now closed and I work supporting young start-ups in a university setting. It's a great job, but I'm not sure I'm a great employee (I like my independence after working for myself for so long).
I'd welcome any tips on starting out in this profession, and if anyone is looking for a freelance, or extra cover in Cardiff/Caerphilly let me know!
A quick intro as this place seems a bit more friendly than some forums!
We've had our moments lol, but yes, it's a very friendly forum. Welcome.
A lot of advertising will be slow burning. I advertised in a local monthly magazine for 10 months and it was only towards the end of it I got 3 new clients and a one off. That covered the whole 10 months and I got repeat work of all 3 the next year, and 2 the year after (the 3rd one shut down. By far the best advertising is word of mouth but obviously you need to gain a client or two first. If you're on facebook certainly spread the word there, and get friends and rellies to do the same. If you drive a sticker on your car works as well I've been told. (My car is full of scrapes and dints otherwise I'd certainly do that one myself)
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John
Any advice given is for general guidance and professional advice should be sought applicable to your circumstances.
remember that until you are MAAT MIP you will need MLR from HMRC. That one's a legal obligation carrying a potential prison term and unlimited fine if you don't comply. Also PII although not a legal requirement is a good idea to have as clients can get very litigous and it doesn't take much to lose your shirt.
I can totally relate to the principle of not playing well with others. I keep getting calls about working full time for companies and must admit that for the most part the thought sends a shiver down my spine after so many years deciding when, where, if and how I work. That said, I still tend to work more with larger companies on a project basis so not your typical contributor here.
The issue that you may have is that at the moment you are doing the fun work of helping Uni startups. It may not be so much fun when the balance of advice to administrative level activities changes. Clients can also be less appreciative when you are regarded as a legal obligation to their business rather than adding value even though you do... Mostly by stopping business owners making inappropriate ill conceived decisions (some business ownerss should not be trusted with anything sharper than a crayon!).
It can take a long time to get established but in your case have you not got the perfect marketing tool for your future endeavor in your current role. i.e. set them up with tohe day job and then help them with their paperwork in the evening and a weekends.
For new start businesses consider around thirty client as being the minimum to go full time. If you do get some larger more lucrative clients, avoid allowing any one client to be more than 15% of your business income. (set 10% as your benchmark but allow scope).
As you grow your clients become your businesses unpaid sales people so always be nice even to the smallest of them. Try to give them something that others do not. Expect to lose a few and gain a few each year. Don't try to be cheaper than everyone else to gain clients as that just attracts the clients who will drop you as soon as they find someone cheaper than you.
Ensure that you have a good engagement letter that clearly states that the accounts are the responsibility of the business owner otherwise they end up thinking that by giving you whatever crap they have accumulated over the year they have somehow absolved themselves of their legal responsibilities and now it's all your problem.
Ensure that you do everything within the letter and spirit of the AAT regulations.
There's loads more to write but I'll leave it to others to fill in the gaps as I need to get back to the grindstone.
Good luck,
Shaun.
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
Your just up the road from me I am based in Bridgend
Have you started AAT Level 4 yet?
Can I expect to hear about an imminent drive by shooting?
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
I *think* I can get a bookkeeping license through AAT which covers MLR, although I do need to get PLI. Need to look into engagement letters in a little more detail, will add to the to do list.
I am planning on completing L4, just investigating how, bit jaded with the local colleges (So far been at Coleg Y Cymoedd, also looked at CAVC, but they are not sure if they will be offering the optional tax modules which are the ones I want to take for obvious reasons) so investigating the online training providers, and experience with these would be welcome.
Need to check the Uni's policy on me recruiting clients from the student base, although it looks like a win win to me! (Albeit they will start off being very low level and low paying clients)
I *think* I can get a bookkeeping license through AAT which covers MLR, although I do need to get PLI. Need to look into engagement letters in a little more detail, will add to the to do list.
I am planning on completing L4, just investigating how, bit jaded with the local colleges (So far been at Coleg Y Cymoedd, also looked at CAVC, but they are not sure if they will be offering the optional tax modules which are the ones I want to take for obvious reasons) so investigating the online training providers, and experience with these would be welcome.
Need to check the Uni's policy on me recruiting clients from the student base, although it looks like a win win to me! (Albeit they will start off being very low level and low paying clients)
Welcome to the madhouse!! Whaddya mean 'other forums' - there are no other forums, only this one. Ok and Accounting web if you dont mind being mauled my tigers!
Anyway, we love it on here so I hope you will too.
You can apply to the AAT for a bookkeeping licence - called the AATQB. But be careful as its pretty restrictive, although IMO rightly so! You will find out why I guess when you delive into level four a bit more especially on the optional tax modules - will make you realise just how much you do not know and how much more there is to learn....its never ending, but despite its obvious frustrations at times (usually HMRC related) it is what keeps the job exciting.
If i may - can I make a suggestion about your level 4 study....avoid the local colleges (OK maybe yours was better than most, but I just hear nothing but trouble!). Also avoid what was once called the Home Learning College, not sure what it is now (must find out!) like the plague. They are on the AAT list of accredited but the name change is an attempt to get away from the direness! Yes defo look at distance learning. Look at those who havewon awards on here - see the banner at the top of the screen. I would recommend something like First Intuition (options from do it on your one ranging through the lectures to live stuff) and supplement it, if you need to, with books from eg Kaplan. I hear good things about Osborne books but have no personal experience, plus BPP (very dry!)
I think Shaun has covered off the rest, but its all been said before so worth a gander round the forum and ask more Qs if you need (sorry, battered with work at the mo!!).
Only other thing - dont get stuck in too much with 'low paying clients'. Its not so easy to increase prices that much so you can end up spending a lot of time working for very little money.
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Joanne
Winner of Bookkeeper of the Year 2015, 2016 & 2017
Thoughts are my own/not to be regarded as official advice,which should be sought from a suitably qualified Accountant.
You should check out answers with reference to the legal position
Thanks Joanne, especially about the L4 providers, it's a big time and money commitment and I want to make sure I choose the right one. I'm aware that AATQB is restrictive, and as you say rightly so.
I'm hoping to try to partner up with local accountants so they can refer bookkeeping to me and I can refer tax and statutory stuff to them. This should also help build my experience in this area so once I've completed L4 I'm able to evidence competence, although from some of the questions posed on here and on AWEB my knowledge seems to be better than some who are already in practice!(Although some of the questions highlight some fairly big gaps in my knowledge)
Can I expect to hear about an imminent drive by shooting?
Hi Shaun
Drive by shooting on local competition No, but on some of my clients now were talking!
Hi Steve
Have you thought about self study for your Level 4, much cheaper and it gives you the flexibility to study when you want, I did Level 2 with a training provider but self studied for both Levels 3&4 all I did was buy the books for each unit, use all the student resources off the AAT website and then booked the exam when I thought I was ready, I know some people hate the idea of self study but it might be worth considering
Good luck in whichever way you choose
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Doug
These are only my opinions of how I see things and therefore should not be taken as advice
From some of the questions posed on here and on AWEB my knowledge seems to be better than some who are already in practice!(Although some of the questions highlight some fairly big gaps in my knowledge)
You could then contribute to the site by answering questions that you believe that you know the answer to.
Some things are however not black and white and there are many instances where people ask the wrong question so you need to guide them to the questions that they need to ask. For example, questions where the site is asked about how to do something but without realising that what they are asking has been superceded or is not applicable to the scenario.
Quite often we also need to know a lot more about the scenario before giving a response. For example, questions about one person limited companies being asked in a manner suggesting that they require exactly the same sort of responses as larger entities.
I don't think that it's fair to suggest that you have better overall knowledge as every accountant no matter what their level will have some gaps considering the enormity of the subject matter and developed specialisations. Also remember that many who post on here and Aweb pretending to be finance professionals are in fact simply business owners trying to do it on the cheap and seeking free advice. Those genuinely in practice who have been through the rigorous training of the more professional bodies will have a good breadth of knowledge (although as indicated nobody knows everything).
Looking forwards to chatting in some technical debates as sure that at times we will end up contributing to some of the same threads and perhaps disagreeing with each other over how certain scenario's should be handled... Those one's are always the most fun where everyone comes away from them with bits of new knowledge and bits of existing knowledge reinforced... Nobody ever learns a subject as well as when you have argued about it.
On the seperate point :
it looks like a win win to me! (Albeit they will start off being very low level and low paying clients)
Mighty oaks from little acorns grow and if you are in on the ground floor then you have the ability to help the company to develop it's processes in the right way before getting into bad habits which are costly to rectify.
Startups generally need more involvement in their development from their representation than established entities that seek only for their finance people to record and report to satisfy legal requirements. Yes, you may lose a few but that said, those that succeed will see you as an integral part of their success... Just be careful not to allow that to become advocacy as there is a thin line between helping clients succeed by giving them the right environment to do so, and making their decisions for them so basically running the company.
kindest regards,
Shaun.
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
