I'm looking for a little bit of help please. Sorry it's a bit long-winded but I want to lay everything on the table.
I work for a small but thriving management firm based in Central Scotland. We run membership database, PA and secretariat, advertising and events for medical associations and charities; we take care of the day-to-day stuff to allow the directors (all professionals in their fields) to get on with the focus of the associations in question. I am one of the bookkeepers, and in the 4 years I've been with the company I've went from working on the clients' accounts to helping train up newbies, dealing with auditors and HMRC VAT inspections, to taking over the company books a couple of years ago and installing a new structure on the accounts so we can more accurately see how the company is doing over the year. Previously the bookkeeper had just logged invoices as/when they came in/were issued and let the accountants sort it at year end. That isn't a criticism, it's just the company was small and the accounts weren't analysed that much back then. Just after I took over the reins, I advised we should be changing things and I've had outside help to sort things out, and it's all going much better.
Over the past year or so, the directors have been talking about installing a Financial Controller (possibly Director) and although I was skittish about it at first - alright, I near crapped myself! - I'm now of a mindset where I feel the job should be mine, given the work I put into the new format of the accounts, forecasting, etc. as well as assisting in interviews for the new bookkeepers coming in. The bookkeeping currently comes under the Admin department but there are 3 bookkeepers and a credit controller here just now (and a bookkeeper in an office in Southampton) and there's been talk of spinning us off to our own department, as the current manager is being stretched thin. I'm kind of the defacto head of accounts as it stands, everyone comes to me for queries, etc.
Now, at my last 1-2-1 with my manager, she has said that the current directors are looking at the option of bringing in an outsider to take the position of Financial Controller, probably for a fixed term, to mentor me with the view to me taking the position permanently eventually. The only thing is my qualifications. I only have an HNC in Accounting, although I have been doing accounts for years now. I did try to do ACCA in 2015, but that turned out to be a helluva year and I had to drop out - we moved house, have 2 autistic kids, my sister passed away from breast cancer, and I had to re-do the accounts for a new client then took over the company books. I did pass my legal exam (F6?) for ACCA and was studying F4 taxation, but I never got the time to study at home or work, and I got the sense from that unit and talking to other students that ACCA is geared more towards the accounting industry, and wouldn't help me in my current position, which is were I want to stay. Given the recent chat, I've been looking further into what qualifications I could gain has led me to CIMA.
Given the kind of things I would be doing, ACCA or anything close to it wouldn't work for me, but I wanted to do my research first and see if there's anything else out there, or if I'm barking up the wrong tree completely! Given what I've read so far, I think this could help me, providing I can get the time to study without major distractions. I was looking to chat to those who have done/are doing the course so I can gain a greater knowledge of what's involved. I'm looking to start next year, providing the new bookkeeper we have just now passes probation and the potential new client in last week doesn't drop accounts on me that will take ages to decode!
Thanks for reading, and in advance, I appreciate any help/advice/comments!
I'm looking to start next year, providing the new bookkeeper we have just now passes probation and the potential new client in last week doesn't drop accounts on me that will take ages to decode!
Hi Bob
Whad what kind of things will you be doing? #
How much time will you have to devote to studies?
What kind of qualification are your bosses looking for?
Will they give you time off for study? Just wondering why the probationary bookkeeper would cause an issue to you doing any kind of course?
# for those not fully in the know
-- Edited by Cheshire on Monday 28th of August 2017 12:32:30 PM
__________________
Joanne
Winner of Bookkeeper of the Year 2015, 2016 & 2017
Thoughts are my own/not to be regarded as official advice,which should be sought from a suitably qualified Accountant.
You should check out answers with reference to the legal position
Well done on passing the law exam with ACCA. That one is normally the stumbling block where a lot of people start to drop out of the qualification.
My experience of CIMA is limited so really just some clarifications about the ACCA. The early papers of ACCA are in many ways like the AAT papers, F1 thru F3 are the basic skillset. F4 through F9 are developng you as a technician. P1 through P7 are developing you as a manager concentrating on developing the LEEMAH acronym :
- Leadership
- Ethical Considerations
- Engagement Performance
- Monitoring
- Acceptance and Continuance procedures
- Human Resources management.
Unfortunately circumstance meant that you dropped out a little early as at the later stages ACCA is basically attempting to turn it's people into Finance Directors in waiting.
CIMA is a sound qulification. As you identify, geared towards management accounting where I would say that the ACCA is more balanced rather than favouring financial accountancy. Fully appreciate that your impressions were developed in the early papers at which point there is still a lot of crossover with the AAT / CAT qualifications.
For what you are looking at I do not think that there is a right or wrong choice. Passing either qualification is a serious achievement that will help to prepare you for managerial level roles.
My own preference is ACCA sd thst'd my qualification. I went down that path many years ago when working with a bank who strongly advised getting a serious financial qualification from the usual choice of two. ACCA or CIMA. I looked at both syllabuses in detail and found the entirety of the CIMA syllabus inside the ACCA one but not the other way around. Now, that they take around the same time must mean that CIMA goes into more detail on a smaller syllabus which if you are looking to be a management accountant or management consultant that can't be a bad thing. I would however say that the ACCA is more well rounded which is why I chose that path and hand on heart I have never regreted the choice that I made.
The CIMA equivalent of me on here is David Ballantyne. If you look through his old posts especially where he's debating with me the old ACCA vs CIMA debate then you will get a more well rounded opinion of the qualifications. start with his old posts and take a look through the threads : http://forum.bookkeepers.network/m1581629/posts/
At the end of the day between those two, whichever route you choose it's going to be the right one as they are both sound qualifications that will give you the knowledge base that you need.
Good luck,
kindest regards,
Shaun.
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
My impression was that this decission was driven more from fear of the unknown than management demanding qualification. Looking from the outside in my concern here would be the temp FC combined with the length of time that either CIMA or ACCA would take. Standard estimate is 3 to 5 years and thats a long time for a temp manager to grow to like the position, build their empire and become the permanent FC.
Conversely, thats also a long leadtime for Bob to develop into the position so his current fears of what the role entails will be long put to bed by qualification.
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Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
Lol. I know the two current posts that you are talking about.
Bob.
just to clarify, neither Joanne or myself are trainng companies.
I am a fully qualified Chartered Certified Accountant with over thirty years working predominantly in corporate.
Considering the CPD requirement of the professional bodies I think that we are all permanently students but what Casu was refering to was people who are just setting out on this path.
__________________
Shaun
Responses are not meant as a substitute for professional advice. Answers are intended as outline only the advice of a qualified professional with access to all relevant information should be sought before acting on any response given.
@Cheshire - most of what I do is day-to-day bookkeeping stuff, invoicing, banking, etc. but the role has developed to give our clients more in-depth knowledge of their accounts. Being non-business people, mostly doctors/nurses, they don't understand finances of a business for the most part, so it's a lot of hand-holding through the accounts, dealing with auditors, VAT returns (including partial exemption), etc. but then we also provide reports on a monthly basis to give updates as to how the year's going, attend their board meetings sometimes, etc. For our own books it's a bit of the same, but our business is more complex than our clients in that we do all their work, plus underwrite small events in the same fields sometimes.
My employer paid the majority of the fees when I started ACCA, covering all registration and exam fees, and half the course fees. I got exemptions from F1, F3 and F3 due to the HNC. I was on day-release from work for classes and the one exam I did do, should be okay to do so again.
As long as I'm getting time at the office, I'll go away into a wee room if needed to study, I had that worked out last time. Only issue is going to be if workload increases a lot again, will mess things up no end.
@Shamus - I wanted to get the law module out the way first. I wasn't too far removed from my HNC, and we did a Scots law module as part of that, contracts, etc. and I knew there wouldn't be much difference. It's dry as hell so I figured get it out the way fast.
I'll look through David's posts later, see what's been said before.
Not writing off ACCA completely, but it's not what we do here, so not sure it would help me in the long term. It is more of a management thing I'll be looking at eventually.
Not sure what you mean by ACCA is not what you 'do' there. But gIven your comments about thinking the job should be yours and your employers having given you such a huge opportunity to do the ACCA via funding and day release etc, are they not hinting at the fact that you should finish what you started under your own steam and that perhaps had you finished it the job could more rightly be yours because you would have then covered off all the other necessary requisites for an FD role via such a qualification, as Shaun indicates?
I wonder if, with all you have had going on in the past, the question seems to be more about do you really want a chartered qualification and all that goes with it, ie the study outside of work and the endless CPD when you have passed etc, rather than which specific qualification, although it does seems a waste not to finish what you have started as let's face it, such a qualification can open doors in many industry sectors at board level.
Sure David will be on soon anyway to give his view, but thought I should add that I've seen more ACCAs on business board level than CIMA guys - I come in from a corporate finance background so have dealt with many hundreds, probably more like thousands, of FDs. Now have my own practice (and funnily enough just seen a cv with both an unfinished AAT and ACCA on it. Have to say that left me with more questions and uncertainty over that candidate against one who had not touched the ACCA).
Ps you don't need the @ when responding.
__________________
Joanne
Winner of Bookkeeper of the Year 2015, 2016 & 2017
Thoughts are my own/not to be regarded as official advice,which should be sought from a suitably qualified Accountant.
You should check out answers with reference to the legal position
